Climatide

People are not crazy who complain about health effects from turbines. Experts in the field in Europe have documented infrasound from these machines which is deleterious to many systems in the body. The wind indusrty had a study done which was unscientific to show there are no health effects and that is what they point to. But people across all countries : Europe, Asia, Australia, Canada, and the United States complain about the same symptoms..There is no conspiracy except on the wind industry side denying health effects. In Australia there are well documented gag orders that land lessors have to sign with the wind industry denying all symptoms from turbines Gov Duval and Ms. Murray (president of the senate) have been well informed of these health effects but they are pushing more illness on citizens ( or locals as Duval Patrick refers to them) at the expense of this industry by pushing the wind siting bill. It is a fact that our legislators don’t care about its citizenry. NO TURBINE of industrial size ( over one megawatt) should be within 2.5 kilometers of any residence. That is the standard that all of Europe is now accepting.

I am similarly sited to the Webb turbine …. Thank you for reporting this horrendous issue in your usual intillegent and fair way.
I look forward to the series. I also hope you might also mention the Webb turbine in the mix. It’s identical to Wind 1 and causing the same set of symptoms…In my case I seldom sleep unless the wind is from the south…my head pounds on concert with the sub audible booming of the turbine ost of the time… l
WEbb is even a harder fight because it was permitted and is a privately owned for profit business. Paid almost entirely by grants….
I have not got the kind of means to hire a lawyer for the battle… as it is my beautiful 6 acre property is unsaleable.
This is causing me both health and financial damage and I really don’t deserve it.
Anyway..you have already done the research, but I am just frayed and venting as well…

Should you have a mind to talk i will.. Sue Hobart 476 Blacksmith Shop road email is tosuehobart@gmail.com

Mr. David McGlinchey’s statement that “existing peer-reviewed studies suggest that there are no health effects associated with the sound and noise from wind turbines” is false and misleading, in my opinion. This is the classic starting point for defending the indefensible — to insist, despite ample evidence of harm from wind turbine noise, or hydrofracking for gas, or any other harmful activity, that the science is “inconclusive” and that “more study is needed.”

Since the technology is relatively new, there have not been a large number of clinical studies done but the ones that HAVE been done have clearly, and unequivocally found that the industrial noise from wind turbines causes significant harm. Articles in publications like Audiology Today and Acoustic Ecology have also reported, after reviewing all available current research, that wind turbine noise poses a clear threat to human health and well-being and to the quality of life for residents.

The more salient point made by Mr. McGlinchey (in an apparent attempt to please everyone) is his admission that people are clearly experiencing symptoms. The fact of the matter is that there are literally THOUSANDS of reports of devastating effects to residents from around the world who have the misfortune to be subjected to wind turbine noise.

So how is it that “existing peer reviewed studies suggest that there are no health effects”? The fact is that this is simply not true.

Think about it.

What is a clinical study of the health effects from wind turbine noise other than a statistical compilation of symptoms — a catalogue of the percentage of people affected, the severity of their symptoms, the various distances that may lie between themselves and the huge machines, the wind direction, their orientation relative to prevailing winds and the like. Do we really a series of controlled, peer reviewed studies to confirm this when THOUSANDS of people describe the same set of intolerable symptoms — in some cases leading to abandonment of their homes — as reported in virtually every major newspaper and mainstream news magazine in the world?

The spectacle of thousands of victims complaining of the same symptoms is not sufficient “proof” to warrant concern? This is not sufficient “proof” to believe that the victims in Falmouth are telling the truth about their suffering? Do we need a peer reviewed study in Falmouth to “prove” that Neil Anderson and 50 of his neighbors are not lying when they say that they are experiencing profound negative impacts — such as chronic sleep deprivation, headaches, ringing in the ears, anxiety and depression?

Of course, the worst temporizers are the Heather Harper’s of the world — who try to appear reasonable, in public, by admitting that, yes, a few people may be experiencing occasional “discomfort” or “annoyance” — but who refuse to end the suffering, or even to ameliorate it, and who, when push comes to shove, always say the same thing: “the Town just can’t afford the loss of revenue.”

Ms. Harper — and the Town of Falmouth — have demonstrated, time and again, in both word and deed, that their solution, and the Town of Falmouth’s solution is nothing more than to deny the extent of the problem, express moderate sympathy — and do nothing.

The town, and its hawkish Administrator, continue to shirk their responsibility to the town’s residents — even though the Town is the owner and the operator of the wind turbine and the perpetrator of the harm — and to sacrifice a significant number of residents as mere “collateral damage”. This is inexcusable.

If Ms. Harper, the Selectmen and other town officials had a shred of decency, they would cease operations of the wind turbines — and the attendant punishment they mete out — immediately while they search for a solution to this self-inflicted wound.

To refuse to do so amounts to nothing less than trading lives for revenue. If that is the town’s philosophy, perhaps they should formulate an explicit policy expressed in terms of the number of dollars of annual revenue they expect to reap in exchange for each resident whose life they are willing to impair.

The article mentions $375,000 in annual revenue and 50 residents complaining about the adverse impacts. That works out to about $7500 per victim.

Granted, it is a subjective exercise to put a firm price on any individual’s health or quality of life, but, in my opinion, Ms. Harper and the Town of Falmouth are not getting a fair price for each of these lives.

Is this the best that they can do per unit of “collateral damage”? If so, this is just another reason for Falmouth to rethink its wind energy “business model.”

Eric Bibler
President
Save Our Seashore

Have there been any measurements of the volume of the noise from this particular turbine, inside and outside nearby homes? Some comparison to background noise decibel levels using measurements over a representative period of time might help place Mr. Anderson’s experience in context for readers as well as for the policy discussion the turbine’s neighbors wish to initiate.

Low-level sound can be horribly annoying, I’ll agree. I don’t care for the slams of car doors all night long at my neighbor’s house, which are transmitted through the sandy soil and through the walls of my house. But the sound is at a low enough level to be simply an unregulatable annoyance that just becomes worse when I think about it. Marking it on a calendar would be a ticket to total insanity because I’d be thinking about it hourly and trying to compare it. How much of people’s adverse reactions to the wind of turbines comes from the frustration of constantly hearing something that annoys them?

Sorry, that should read “sound of turbines,” not “wind of turbines”.

The links to download and listen to the story are broken. Can somebody please fix them? Thanks.

Fixed now. Thanks for pointing that out.

Many people who live near WIND1 are hearing little or nothing, and have no complaints.
But they’re unwilling to speak up because of the hysteria from a handful of their neighbors.
This quiet majority is not covered by the press.
When others go to the area to listen, they don’t hear much, if anything.
The Town’s noise study shows WIND1 complies with state law.
The Falmouth board of health concluded there’s no health risk.

Ever wonder about the people who live near the oil-fired electric plant in Sandwich?
Or the nuclear plant in Plymouth?
Not to mention the Gulf Coast – or the hundreds of coal miners who die every year.

Clean renewable energy benefits everyone. The exaggerated complaints should be ignored.

In all my searching of peer-reviewed scientific studies, I have been unable to find the unequivocal proof of health problems you mention. But I do think a weight of evidence is emerging and warrants attention from public policymakers. What I, for one, would like to see is a discussion grounded in the precautionary principle, rather than a fight for scientific one-upmanship.

There have been two sound studies – one commissioned by the town, and one commissioned by nearby residents. Both can be found on the town website: http://www.falmouthmass.us/deppage.php?number=426
Your last question is one a handful of scientists are trying to address. But I think there’s a different question public officials and society need to address: Do psychological impacts warrant less consideration than physiological ones?

The precautionary principle is a great one. We should be taking many actions as precautions against scarcity of dwindling fossil fuel supplies, related economic and geopolitical risks, and the huge risks of climate change. We should be deploying renewable energy as fast as we can. Swoosh-swoosh is really the LEAST of our worries…

The Equal Protection Clause of our government’s Fourteenth Amendment should equally afford protection to those ill effected neighbors around Falmouth’s Wind One, as well as those neighbors as close or closer but having no complaints.

The history of consequence provided by the wind industrialization of Europe was and is ignored by our Government. Various past and present Presidential Administrations focus on the “Green” future while sacrificing measures of public protection for profiting wind developers (yet another ponzy-scheme).

Priorities must be measured with more than an eye on profit. Our government, federal all the way down to local, suffers from this blind-eyed malady. And, for what it’s worth, seems ‘Anonymous’ suffers similar symptoms.

The Equal Protection Clause of our government’s Fourteenth Amendment should equally afford protection to those ill effected neighbors around coal mines, oil rigs, gas wells, nuclear plants, mid-east wars, and climate change.

Careful what you wish for….and wait until the seagull carcasses start piling up. They don’t call them “Condor Cuisinarts” for nothing.. Drill baby drill!

I agree. Some people are just not happy unless they are complaining about somthing, wah, wah, wah. If you don’t like it, then move. I for one am looking forward to the savings on my energy bill!

I think that the issue here is not sheer decibels of audible noise, but subsonic sounds just out of the hearing range at high decibels. I remember a nova science special that found that elephants communicated over hundreds of miles using subsonic noises that no human could hear and it was only discovered when instruments specifically looked for it. Link
http://www.physorg.com/news4211.html

These sounds could be closely compared to large bass speakers in cars heard from blocks away….only at much higher decibels in this case.

My hypothesis also explains why some are effected and some are not…everyones ears are different and affected by age.

If you want to try this on the other end of the sound spectrum, look at the mosquito ring tone apps on most phones. You can move the frequency of the sound so high that you cannot hear it but you can still feel something.

Any comments appreciated,

ctcabm

Fail!

scarcity? Old oil wells are filling up. Oil is produced by natural processes inside the earth. The term “fossil fuel” is a misnomer.

Sorry to hear that Falmouth got hoodwinked on this corporate welfare Ponzi scheme. I live in Brimfield and we just sent First Wind packing for all the health reasons that have been documented. Wind power belongs in non-populated ares–Not these “one-off turbines” that are popping up all over MA.

I wish the tree huggers would have to pay all these expenses out of their pockets. No more paper bags at the grocer…wups no more plastic bags at the grocer…wups no more oil power we need wind power wups no more coal wups $5 a gal gas. Next time you see someone from the Sierra Club. PETA or any of these other “I care more than you do” buffoons bust them one in the mouth and tell them to shut the h-e double toothpicks up. We have politely put up with their antics until civilization has gone backwards. These same yahoos that are whining now probably fought to get the darn windmill put up. There were trees in front of courthouses that doubled as gallows, maybe time to break out an old custom.

Well a Tawainese farmer has claimed a windmill killed his goats, http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/8060969.stm
Then there is the destruction by polution of a lake in China from a factory that makes batteries for windmills in England. Fish ,wildlife and children have been sickened from lead poisoning. It’s been proven white noise or any constant noise for that matter can make people sick.

I have heard that you do not want to live within 2 miles of a wind turbine for precisely these reasons.

Hey its all about saving the Earth right? A little noise and a few sleepless nights is not to much to ask for the sake of humanity and the planet. The same folks who have been preaching this green crap for years to the rest of us are now suddenly the ones complaining. If the shoe were on the other foot we wouldn’t get a bit of consideration. It would be viewed as a noble cause. Independant peer reviewed science is what’s needed before we make any hasty decisions that might harm the planet. I suspect it will all get ironed out in a few years or more, likely long enough to put a serious dent in property values….. especially if these folks keep complaining. Kind of a catch 22 aint it! But from the rest of us energy consumers here in the midwest….. thanks for all your help. Think I’ll turn up my heat now.

this “corporate welfare ponzi scheme” was pushed and pushed and pushed by Obama and his Sierra club cronies. Ah, the law of unintended consequences once again proves true. When are you people ever going to learn.

5 million devided by 375,000 add in interest and maintanacne figure 15 to 20 years to pay for itself, what is the life expectency? Oh what the hell as long a sObama’s friends at GE make a good buck that is all that really counts.

Ef you Mass. You are a bunch of screaming lefties looking for everyone else to pay for your liberalism. You and GE belong together. I hope you give each other chirpies. Live with your wind farm noise, and I’ll take my nukes and oil drilling any day.

The libtard Berkenstock tribe are even NIMBY’s when it comes to one of their loves? I bet they wouldn’t give a rats ass if it was stuck out in the country and bothered someone else. Also if you have ever noticed they don’t work for crap, libtards or wind mills.

Looks like the greenies can’t be satisfied. Wait until the 200 ft blades Ice up and start slinging 200 lb ice blocks about…Oh yes, the controls will prevent that from happening…

Come on now. If you’re gonna be good Massachusettsans who know what’s best for the rest of us — you know, none of that dirty old oil and coal and stuff — ya gotta be prepared to waive those NIMBY rights to set a good Greeeen example for the rest of the Obama voters.

Drill drill drill… rinse and repeat

Wow. You have really bought into the propaganda. The earth isn’t dying. We aren’t killing the environment, and while we play with pinwheels the smart countries are drilling for oil.

Liberals are just annoyed by the noise. A conservative is honest enough to admit that the things are ugly, too. Do we really want our landscape covered with windmills? They can’t provide more than a fraction of our energy needs anyway. Nuclear energy is the only realistic solution in the long term. Let’s stop playing around and face reality.

The only reason there’s a scarcity of fossil fuel supplies is that the environmentalists won’t let us drill anywhere in this country. Drop all these stupid regulations and we’re set.

I’m not a liberal or a MGW believer but I live within a mile of a similar unit in Lewes Delaware and I haven’t heard a peep from it nor have I heard of a complaint from anyone else. Haven’t heard of any birds piling up either but I’ll have to go get a closer look. Just my experience.

They’re great for bird control also…raking feathers can be a problem at first, but it only lasts a few months. Some seasonal problems with dead flocks, but for the most part there is no more pesky bird problems.

No wind turbines near me here in Seattle, but I can relate very well to distant resonance sound causing mild disturbance to the body. Living 1/4 mile from a commercial shipyard I get a mild headache and unsettled feeling from the massive pumps/compressors/generators running 24/7. It is like a ultra low throbbing sound that you’re unsure of it being outside or in your own head. My wife doesn’t feel or hear anything, but I sure can so it may be a genetic predisposition. It’s only certain container ships and most always at night. I don’t complain because I can deal with it, but I don’t even have to look out the window to know when a certain Chinese freighter is docked. When, after three days, the ship leaves it is an amazing relief. One doesn’t even realize how bad it was affecting you until the sound stops. Anyway, good luck with the windmill thingy.

@ 6% interest 30 years of payments would be needed before this thing breaks even, it it never needed either corrective nor preventative maintenance. Any bets that this thing will last until it is paid off?

Gee, this luser of a windmill is going to “save” $375K a year? But it COSTS $5 million? How long is it’s life span? How much is the maintenance? Sounds like they are spending a quarter to save a dime.

You’re too optimistic: you’re also ignoring the cost of capital (interest payments on the bond…) Of course, this only amplifies your bigger point…

GEs making a fortune off the back of the US taxpayers…..and, guess what?, the VOLT is being supported by Obama because of the GE battery stations that are necessary to keep the 28 mile charge going…….40 mph max……>$40,000………what a good idea!!!!!

You bleeding heart Kennedy lovers up there wanted wind farms just not in your back yard. Well you have them now so live with them

I live 1/4 mile from a turbine powering our local small town university in the midwest. We hear nothing! They are correct about the wind speed issue. These turbines function best in a constant steady wind. The local turbine here is always turned off during storms and high winds.

Seems to me some operational protocols need to be reviewed.

The problem is most of the blades and related equipment are made in Europe

So much for Green Power. I am all for it as long as it is not near me, just like that Teddy Kennedy.

Try spending a few nights in one of the houses abutting these windmills and you’ll change your mind. And as for the moronic comment by NoColored Glasses, the houses were there BEFORE the windmills. Are you willing to compensate them for the loos they would take on selling their houses? Or better yet, why don’t you just volunteer to buy them out?

And… how much is the interest on the $5M?

Sure they are. As a matter of fact, I hear you’re full of it.

Those Massholes never will learn.

You are delusional. I guess a major power line and relay station would be safer. Your an idiot and an evil con man. You must be a big oil investor. Your a liar and a fool for thinkin anyone would believe this hoax. I hope that turbine blows you away from all people who think logically and sober. Quit smokin the meth and pounding the booze. It might help your delusional paranoia.

Not in my backyard I guess you mean. Like algore says, do what I saw, not as I do. Typical of a libtard.

They asked for it, they supported it, they got it. Funny, I bet they were all goo-goo eyed when that montrosity was approved—”Look we’re affecting change!”

Still, I don’t know how any administrator would approve a 5 mil investment that wouldn’t hope to see any savings or return for well over a decade. As has been noted above, not to mention maintainence costs–which I am sure is quite spendy given the niche market.

Again, i’m sure they were all goo-goo eyed, and tears were shed during the community meetings when this thing was approved.

Drill, baby, drill. Oil works, it’s effective, relatively cheap, and there is lots of it still in the ground. Absent that, nuclear: educated jobs (with holders having concrete knowledge), effective, and forward-looking. “Individual communities going it alone with windpower smacks of tribalism, is redundant, is ineffecient, and as shown above- counter productive.

Still, it is a little funny the greenies have to live with their own decisions for once!

You would think the scientist with the Robinson’s in “Lost In Space” would welcome new clean energy. WARNING!!! DANGER WILL ROBINSON!!!

Our Founder DID NOT want these windmills anywhere near The Compound.

And he was Right!

READ THIS!!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/moslive/article-1350811/In-China-true-cost-Britains-clean-green-wind-power-experiment-Pollution-disastrous-scale.html

I’d like to step in here and say two things. First of all, thanks for joining the conversation. Second of all, what we’re trying to have here is a conversation. By all means voice your thoughts and opinions, but know that name-calling, swearing, and excessively derogatory language are not called for and will not be tolerated. I use the delete key reluctantly, but will use it.
That’s all. Carry on …

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I hope to God that eventually the libs get their way & place hundreds of these things off the Cape’s Coast.

What’s sad is the total uselessness of these on top of the fact the harm they actually do to nature.

Never really understood the humor in Don Quixote until now

Quit your f—ing whining all of you!

30-40% of cost is direct subsidies (your tax money) and the remaining 60-70% is from your electrical rate dollars. Wine Turbines deliver little to nothing promised by their promoters. They produce all sorts of problems those raking in the cash like to deny, dismiss and down-play. Wind Turbines produce unreliable electricity that unbalances the grid unless we build more peaking plants and turn down our efficient base load sources (making them less efficient). They also produce energy when no one wants it or uses it at 2-4 times the cost of base load. Throw in destroying the property values and health of neighbors…. These are one of the largest scams ever forced on the citizens. When will the legislators stop shoving our cash into the G-Strings of these wind turbine pole dancers?

simple, if a tree was blocking your sun for your garden to grow food to live how long would the tree stand? I say george washington had the right idea, I just wouldn’t ‘tell the truth’ about ‘how’ the loud tree came down….savvy?

Bunch of F—ing whining New England C–ts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bS0LQedWGb8

I bet you never considered these guys….but its a complete game changer

That’s assuming other electrical costs don’t go up in the next 30 years. Wanna bet electricity costs at least double in the next 20 years?

I have no idea is the sound from these things are damaging. However, as far as the costs go, all of you are assuming that electrical costs will stay at their current levels when calculating the ROI on it. Wanna bet electrical costs double in the next 20 years?

It’s called a sound pressure meter and it costs $30 at Radio Shack. It will give you a pretty close working detail of a noise source’s decibels. This is just basic science, and instead of getting all touchy feelie with ‘quality of life’, it will provide concrete anLysis into whether a turbine off in the distance is louder across the frequency range than your heater/ac, tv and anything else. However if you’re looking for a lawsuit, then it’s probably best to avoid such technical details. It’s pretty poor reporting, but these stories are always cultivated to soften opinion of a lawsuit jury.

But if we’re going to talk science, then we should take this whole wind power alternative energy nonsense out behind the barn and bury it. Wind power is expensive, ineffective and a false solution for a false problem. AGP and alternative energy schemes are an invented crisis to benefit a few companies. Hysteria, terrible new reports (like the sympathy baiting garbage above) and lots of repitition are the tools used to keep sowing panic among those who want to consider themselves ‘sensitive’ to their environment.

I think this guy is right they should tear down the turbine near his house, because its superstitious nonsense wrapped in sciency sounding terms, but he should also have to shut his stupid eco business for the same reasons.

Don’t you know… Snake oil is always green.

Welcome to Obama’s new world! Stop all this silliness with “green” energy! It’s a fraud. Drill for oil. For every single person alive today, OIL is the energy source of the future. Let’s not worry about 300 years from now, shall we?

I work for a large utility that own a lot of wind farms, as well as the spread of nuke, hydro, fossil, etc. The big big boss was caught telling someone that we would lose money like crazy if the subsidies ever ended and we had to pay for all of the wind turbines. It is far more profitable to put up a combined cycle plant.

Quick little financial math here. Assuming a 15 year useful life which is pretty standard for wind turbines, this project is generating less than a 2% return on capital. Even if Falmouth can access cheap debt financing there is no way this boondoggle is not destroying the wealth of residents whose taxes are paying for it.

Quit being a God Damn baby

Anonymous, come up with a recipe for diced seagull and it’s win win for you

The blinking lights at night ruin the night sky view. The worst part, is they will not pay for themselves in the long run. Sales Reps from the windwmill companies know the blades will only last about 8-9 years, but they have according to the cost benefit analysis of almost 20 years. Get ready to start pumping more money into them sooner rather than later. China’s new dam generates the same amount of power as 19 nuclear power plants for the last several years. We better get a grip on providing cheaper power, or prepare to be a follower in this world rather leading.

Sounds like these folks haven’t had the new automobile fads hit there yet:

Modified exhausts that don’t muffle the sound, but amplify it to ear splitting levels that can be heard a mile away, windows closed, in a well insulated home.

The shriek of the motor cycles, and obnoxious fart from the cars sporting these disdainful implements? You can’t get sleep if you are within a mile of a road. We’ve got trees that would soften the noise, but I can still hear the jerk as he makes his turn 2/3s a mile from my property.

—-

Yes, the wind farms do have some disadvantages. They screw up the weather radars that see the tornadoes coming in. (Have to see how the dual-pole build works in that environment.)

Alternatives are necessary, and oil is dead. The east Gulf–for those interested in drilling–is a limited ROI. Time to find something else… And maybe stop the oil co’s from squashing alternative energy investigations?

Can’t get a Geo Metro anymore. That production car had a 55 mpg. Best you can get these days will have you signing a third mortgage on your home to fill your next gas tank. It’s hands in the pockets of many, and nothing will change until THAT changes…

Take care…

Years ago, when they put up one on a mountain near Boone, North Carolina, a bunch of us started a ‘cult,’ called the Whooshies, in honor of the annoying noise it made day and night. I find it funny that the liberals in a liberal state are starting to complain. Heh-heh-heh.

Let’s put obuma at the end of a 500 foot tall stick, make him hold all 3000 pages of his health care bill, and let his ears catch the breeze to generate enough power to light up the entire planet !!!! Energy crisis solved………….

There are four turbines in the area. There are no noise complaints for the Otis Air Base turbine, nor the private industry one. The one built by the Town is the source of the noise. So…although the tone on the radio was that turbines cause noise it appears that like other machines .. cars, planes etc each model has its own signature.

Fight fire with fire. Bring in a marine biologist who will testify to the Falmouth town council that the windmill is creating subsonic vibrations that are causing impotence in dolphins as far away as Nantucket. Dolphins are more valuable then people to the treehuggers.

Wind promoters criticizing one well known study of people whose health is negatively affected by turbines complained that the studies author only talked with people whose health was so negatively affected that they ABANDONED THEIR HOMES to escape. Seriously. If you live near one of these giant tax shelters, you can except your property values to drop around 30% IF you can find a buyer at all. People in Ontario and in Wisconsin have walked away from their homes (their largest asset) because they could not live near a turbine and once the turbine was there no one would buy their home.

As others have pointed out, there is NO benefit to the general public. But there are plenty of negative consequences for these high priced disasters. In December 2010 our federal legislators extended the Section 1603 grant money for another year. This pays wind developers 30% of their cost in an up front cash grant of federal tax money. It isn’t just Obama. Call you legislators and ask them to recind the Section 1603 grants. Stop squandering money we don’t have on things we don’t want and don’t need.

You know, if environmentalist really cared about the environment, then they wouldn’t litter the landscape with these eyesore monoliths.

Blades made in Europe, LOL, maybe 4 years ago. Look at these pictures: http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700038429/Tooele-depot-getting-wind-power.html
Its all China now.

I swear, everything that a liberal thinks up, or shoves down everyones throat “for the good of the prople” ends up being a disaster. Truly, the road to hell is paved with good intentions with these mentally ill people. Social Security, Medicare, wind turbines, anti oil, anti nuclear anti digging for oil, anti death penalty,pro abortion, pro gay rights, anti marriage, I could go on….we have to run over and defeat these people before it is too late. Actually, it may be too late…..

We all must sacrifice, in order to SAVE THE PLANET!

Just follow the example from http://www.LIVESHOT.cc

suck it up greenies……
nuke nuke nuke!

Uhh, I think the OP is pointing out the absurdity of the propaganda, and the irony of it all.

I agree, I’ve seen these things in all their three-dimensional hideousness, they’re ugly as hell, a blight on the skyline. When they’re in motion it’s nothing but mind-boggling “visual pollution.”

A National Energy Policy designed to RAISE the cost of energy by subsidizing inefficient energy sources and taxing affordable energy sources is insane on the face of it. If the only way to restore sanity is to start impeaching people that is a very small price to pay. Defund the EPA and drill in ANWR and the Gulf before gasoline prices tank the economy.

Well, if the government says there’s no health effects then we must believe everything about this turbine is ok. Right? Let’s put one at the White House for the Obamas to enjoy.

Why do they hate capitalism? It’s been so good to them.

Hard to believe our tax dollars go to support the tripe put out by wcai/wgbh.

We used to stop at an RV park that had one almost inside the park. I found the swishing humming noise quite restful. And I don’t think they are ugly, but I’m also not stupid enough to think they can produce an adequate supply of energy on an uninterupted basis. We need nuclear power and to drill baby drill. Anything else is a waste of time and dare I say energy?

I am 100% convinced if I could put solar and wind generaters on my home and provide 90% of my own needs, the electirc company, state and feds would find a way to charge me for the money they lost.
At 65 y/o the one thing I have learned is my conserving saves me zero in my wallet in the long term. Electric car will be the same thing, your electric rates will go up beyond the cost of driving a gas car.

Wait until spring when Anderson wakes up and finds 6,000 dead migratory birds on his lawn,

hmmm. lets see. no wind turbines because they are too noisy. No solar in the NE because it’s too damn dark and in the SW because everybody loves it, but no one loves it near them or anything they like. No coal, oil or nuclear because they’re just plain evil. Looks like we’ll all be sitting in the dark freezing our butts off in the near future. Good times.

The needs of the many outweights the needs of the few. Sorry, your house is causing global warming. You need to reduce your carbon footprint by moving back into town.

Wind and solar power is unreliable, extremely expensive when available, and environmentally destructive. A typical communist/eco-nazi scheme – right?

Oh yeah, just vote for Obummer again in 2012 and see what happens when he REALLY doesn’t care about getting reelected.

Wanna bet maintenance costs double in the next 10 years?

Hottest job after the 2012 elections….windmill lumberjack.

The first place these windmill farms should be placed is off the Kennedy compound, Streisand compound, Cronkite compound, etc…

“It is dangerous. Headaches. Loss of sleep. And the ringing in my ears never goes away.”

Oh Shut Up.

Damned environmentalists are NEVER happy.

The green religion is deadly.

The religion where things hoped for(fantasized) becomes the substance of the religion in spite of the fact that the reality of the thing hoped for is totally fruitless.

Green dogma is dead and deadly. We need responsible environmental stewardship lead by diverse godly scientists who do not believe that by simply studying the order of god’s created universe does not somehow at the same time make them some kind of demi-god or “eco-czar”.

Get the academic ideologues and the Marxists out of the “green” movement and we can all move forward in environmental reality and not in the schemes of those like Al Gore who profit from the green Ponzi Scheme. Symbolism does not equal substance. Green minus red= progress.–Chauncey Freeman

Way to flex your ignorance muscle. I’m sure you are up to date on all the climate change data as well. Can you tell me the adjustment in global temperatures over the last decade? And while you are at it, go ahead and research the oil discoveries over the last period.

There were about 200 wind turbines in California some 20-odd years ago, placed in a line of the high Sierras. Suddenly after 2 years of operating – from time to time, with an average of about 25% of their maximum capacity – their output of kilowatts dropped by a half. Their cost was by law mixed in with the cost of normal plants (gas and nuclear). Teams climbed up to see what happened; every turbine was “surrounded about its base by some 6 feet high cemetery of dead birds, among them rare albatrosses and bald eagles. The true Cuisinarts for birds! How about it you eco-nazis and commies?

*over the same period

http://www.startribune.com/business/112581389.html

Made in South Dakota and Iowa also!

Way to bring a logical argument.

The other foolishness is that this turbine must have 100% back up generation ready at all times, just in case the wind does not blow, or blows too hard.

You just have to figure that a libtard tree huggy Birkenstock wearing greenie would forget about the fact that the wind does not always cooperate with their fantasy wind farm plans…

DRILL, MIne, hydro power, and forget these huge money pits with turbines and propellor blades.

This article could use audio of the turbine in operation, so people could hear for themselves how unacceptable large turbines are. Like electric cars, wind power has its uses, but it’s not ready for prime time yet, and may never be. Yet another radical Green boondoggle doing more harm than good. Wake up, America.

There once was a dolphin from Nantucket…

E X P E C T E D to save $375,000 per year. Hmmmm anyone want to bet on the actual savings?

For years the oil rigs around my house kept me awake with the thump thump thump of those old single cylinder Ajax engines pump pump pumping that oil. Now it’s so hard to get a permit to pump and the eco-liability so high that they have shut most of them down, and the jobs that they produced. But, now I get to sleep more soundly knowing that the ninny babies who complained are secretly wishing we’d start drilling again on American soil.

Drill here, drill now and let the Arab world bathe in their worthless commodity and each others blood. End terrorism, end foreign entanglements and war, create real jobs here at home, lower the cost of gasoline and close the EPA. (And put Ponzi-Scheme green climate alarmists (Al Gore et al on trial and make them pay reparations for the damage they have done to our economy, children’s minds and our productivity.) We can have your father’s America again, it just takes citizen leadership.

Wind turbines are noisy, and can be dangerous (I saw a video of what happens when one of these things comes apart — large metal fragments scattered for miles!) If I had to choose between living next to a conventional coal/oil fired power plant, a wind turbine, or a nuclear plant, I’d choose the nuclear plant and the wind turbine would be my last choice.

Wind energy turbines work great in unpopulated areas, like out on the great plains. Unfortunately, that’s not where we need the power.

Bottom line, though, is that they are not cost effective. The Falmouth turbine has a “theoretical” break even point in about 25 years — IF maintenance costs are at the low end of the estimates. (When was the last time that happened in a Government enterprise?)

People who have to put up their own money would never spend it on wind turbines. But apparently it’s okay to spend taxpayer money on these green energy schemes if it makes the environmentalists and the politicians they’re leaning on feel good about themselves.

wow, do the math, they spent 5 mil to save less than 400k a year, so it will take them more than 10 years to just break even, how many of them will still be around living by then under that constant noise? This is like Abbott and Costello show..

Burn more coal

windmills, man? yeah, let’s all go medieval and have lords and serfs and such too…

The law of unintended consequences.

God forbid that Mr. Anderson’s “hobby” should be inconvenienced by something that will help save the planet from global warming (er, climate change – sorry). Would he be happier if he had to wade through six inches of water to reach his composting toilet in the middle of the night? (Several times, I suspect, from the look of his picture!) I’m sorry; the individual’s selfish desires have to be subordinated to the greater good. Thankfully, we have some really smart guys from Harvard and MIT to help us figure what that is (oops – pace Larry Summers – smart gals too).

They deserve this.

Have to chuckle at this. New England liberals are great ones for telling the rest of the world how to live and how to be good stewards of the environment, no matter what the cost. Now, when someone puts one of these environment-saving monstrosities in THEIR backyard, they have all sorts of complaints. Well, folks, time to put your money where your mouth is. You want all of these changes in our life style to “save the environment”, so you are just going to have to live with what you’ve asked others to put up with. Come on, folks. Think of how much you’re helping Mother Nature. lol

Hey, the enviro-wackos say you must have a wind turbine. So deal with it.

Central and Northern Iowa is covered with wind turbines, lots of cell phone towers, and rural water towers.

“So, both sides are right.”

NO, THEY ARE NOT, AND CANNOT BE.
IF “ONE SIDE” EXPERIENCES HEADACHES, CONTINUAL HUMMING IN THE EARS, AND LACK OF SLEEP, THEN THERE EXIST NEGATIVE HEALTH EFFECTS.

THAT is the side that is “right.”

So if it works perfectly for 10 years or so, and inflation doesn’t happen, and the money couldn’t have been invested better (opportunity cost)…. then they will break even.

Was the turbine subsidized by the feds? It MUST have been. why no comment on this in the story?

The calendar, of course, is heart-breaking. Ever thought of ear plugs? What about really loud music? World travel? Pounding, pounding, pounding – how about sex?

Today’s wind farms are sited so as to minimize bird deaths. The average number is 2 per year per turbine and 3-4 per turbine for bats. Not 6000.

Comrade, this is what a good citizen must endure for the good of the party.

I work for a company that operates a nuclear plant as well as wind, solar, and a small hydro plant. Just to give everyone an idea of their different outputs; Today the nuclear reactor is operating at 1157 MWe, the dam is producing 5 MWe, the wind farm 22 MWe, and the solar 0 MWe.
We only have one reactor and the wind farm covers the hills in the area just about as far as the eye can see. Can’t say that I hear them, but they are definitely unsightly to look at. I just wanted to point out the difference in generation. Nuclear puts wind and solar to shame.

I believe the $30 Radio Shack meter you refer to measures decibels and not really sound pressure. It can not measure low-frequency noise in the hz frequencies that cause problems. Sound pressure may be below audibility. And, yes, a person may sense sound presence acutely without it being audible.. There are units to measure sound pressure/low-frequency noise; these are expensive; and a professionally-qualified sound engineer is needed for accurate measurements and analyses. Low-Frequency Noise emissions are a huge problem—LFN’s pass readily through materials such as wood and glass: concrete block or brick walls will generally stop or at least reduce it. Noise emissions may be manifestly stronger INSIDE, say, a wood-frame house, than outside. Google “low-frequency noise problems” if you are seriously interested…

Wind turbines run about 42 % of the time on average. So, to get the desired output, you have to build twice as many.

“peer-reviewed studies” = censorship.

Funded left wing alarmist type scientists grouping together to censor opposing views endangering their livelihood and ideology.

Emailgate educated us all on “peer review”. Basically, the same group of people.

I don’t like the giant monstrous monuments to PC-think any more than you do, but if you believe this poorly crafted suburban myth, I have a some dead polar bears I would like to sell you…

Poor little babies. How was it to grow up in a free country? Now that your stupidity (of who you voted for), and the nanny-state your ignorant generation created will hopefully put a damper on your golden years….

As this Turbine is located in an area of the country where “iceing” can occur I am surprised it was allowed to be located in the proximity of anyones home. When ice buildup on blades reaches the point at which its weight is rejected by centrifugal force the ice “chunks” can be moving at speeds of 150 MPH. Rejected ice has been known to bend 3/8″ steel plate.

If libtards learn math, they can figure out that most of this enviro-BS does not add up. If they learn science, they can figure out that most of the enviro-BS is lacking in scientific basis. Too bad libtards run the schools.

Like all artificial remedies, these monstrosities are highly subsidized. They are also miserably ineffective, so they probably produce an overall negative value (if a negative value can be produced) .

The problems and dangers to humans from low-frequency noise emissions, even sub-audible emissions, are well researched and documented. For one thing, LFN emissions pass readily through most materials except brick, concrete, rock, etc. A wood-frame house and its windows are no deterrent—indeed, such a closed structure may manifest the emissions/sound pressure even more strongly inside than outside. LFN’s travel huge distances. (Google “low-frequency noise problems” if seriously interested.) Large industrial fans are oftentimes the source of LFN (cousins of wind power towers)—such fans can be quieted but a professional sound engineer is needed to accurately measure the emissions and determine the solution, as changing the blade design, speed, sound-reducing material, etc.

Not far to the north of this town lies a nuclear power facility called Seabrook Station. When it was proposed in the early 1970′s, the two reactor power plant came in at an estimated cost of $500 million. Unfortunately, protest groups made such a stink the the station ended up with just a single reactor and a final price tag of $5 billion. In the 21 years since the station opened, it has operated with no problems reported. No throbbing noises, no pounding, no headaches, no dead birds, and no dead people.

Shear ignorance and stupidity have been the guiding principles of this nation’s energy policy since the mid 1970′s, but we’re just now starting to see how much that ignorance and stupidity is going to cost us all.

We should go nuclear. It’s the most reliable source of clean energy.

That’s a bargain in government thinkin.

Hey Neil: Did you vote the lib line? If so, enjoy the Change. If not, get your silly MA friends to vote out the entire lib nutjobs.

This blog is really about the dumbing down of America. Wind efficiency, bird-kill, greed, green-mania, maintenance cost, Kennedy compound, bean counting, drill baby drill, Obama, dolphin death, Constitutional virtue, sacrifice to save mother earth, Massholes etc. The point of this blog seems riddled with complaints. The point of the piece simply put, is that there are too many unanswered questions about health impact and turbines. It’s good so many weigh-in… but for God’s sake stay on topic. (i.e. dumbing down of the American public)

Because there are so many unanswered questions (though the wind industry and some politicians would have you believe otherwise) the tone of this piece is to caution against a rush to implement such a potentially costly innovation.

Standing at the top of a cliff – contemplating the quickest way down to the canyon floor
The wiseman would find alternatives to a jump to his death.

Not to mention the cost on the environment of producing so many toxic element filled batteries. Guess the third world will be a dumping ground for those, too.

Nuclear is safer, cleaner, cheaper than all other options combined. We have the technology to make it even safer than ever before.

Back in the early 90′s, I lived in the SF Bay Area and occasionally drove out through Tracy, where those giant windmill farms are located. Talk about ugly! Absolute rape of the environment.

Is this like the peer-reviewed folks and the world-wide climate study? I’ll never trust scientists ever again. Obviously, scientists of leftist bent will lie just as they did in ClimateGate.

We have forgotten the most basic law in the physical universe which is the conservation of energy. The wind force that powers these academic assemblies of metal does not come for free. It results in slowing down the natural wind currents that the earth’s climate uses to achieve its current dynamic equilibrium. That equilibrium is changed by these things which is a true case of man altering the climate–possibly sometimes for the better but nevertheless changing it. A line of windmills is analogous to a dam on a river except the fluid is air instead of water. Basic physics has been ignored in all the green energy “solutions”. Solar panels in the desert will result in a vastly different climate since the sun’s energy no longer heats the desert floor but now will go to LA. The only form of energy with almost no impact is nuclear. A small amount of uranium is gone and is replaced by a number of fission byproducts. Nearly all harmless but the problem radioactive ones can easily be stored away until they decay in 20 millennia or so. Remember, the US Navy has been powered by nuclear reactors for half a century now without one nuclear accident. Nuclear has the best track record around, especially realizing that Chernobyl was the predicted result of inherent Communist incompetence. The absence of unfixable long-term effects is proven by Hiroshima and Nagasaki, now the two most beautiful cites in the world–Google some pictures and see. The earths crust is full of natural radioactivity anyhow, the decay-released energy from this is what powers some volcanoes.

add to the mix all the legal fees being spent to shut this behemoth down, and then add also the cost of logging it away to the scrap heap of AGW great ideas… show me the savings!

Ain’t the law of unintended consequences grand?

really, the science is settled on this, the health problems are very real, those who deny are like the flat earth society.

The area of Falmouth and Hyannis, Mass. are home to hundreds of species of birds, equating to tens of thousands of birds in flight in the area. And you’re saying only two per year will get hit there? Good grief, whose payroll on you on?

HAHA that’s the funniest thing I’ve heard today. How many millions did they blow hiring liberal college dorks to graph the bird flyways? And they place the turbine in the strongest wind current birds be damned. And that 2 per turbine is a complete lie, I live 40 miles from a 150 turbine windfarm and have family that works there. They are instructed to clean up and dispose of any and all birds/bats on the ground. And there are MANY bags full of them yearly.

And let’s not forget the devastation they bring to the raptors who hunt the hills at Altamont Pass.

The only way to get numbers for all these green technologies to add up is to forget the laws of physics. Unfortunately, most of the loudest proponents of these boondoggles haven’t forgotten the physics, they never knew them to begin with. The people who want to ban the proven methods of energy generation seem to think that they can get something for nothing. Our government might entertain their ignorance, but mother nature will not.

Ya to pay for these stupid turbines!

I’m living here now. Get over your esthetic ‘ugly’. Nothing was raped. What bugs me is that I never see more than 30% of them ever spinning!

The low-frequency noise emissions from the turbines are the problem. The emissions are a function of the blade and its speed. Large industrial fans often cause LFN problems to residentials areas—but industrial fan systems may be altered to alleviate the problem. That is not easily done with a wind turbine.

LFN emissions are a serious and increasing problem around the world. The research and quantifying of data OVER DECADES most clearly indicates the harm and dangers to humans from LFN emissions (Google “low-frequency noise problems”)…It is a mystery how an area with such a highly-educated population ever acquiesced to be subjected to wind turbines.

Ya, they will if they can force carbon cap crap on us, part of Obummers Hope and CHANGE Plan

Smoking was once considered by experts to be perfectly safe in moderation.

And we all know what Wilfred Brimley said about Oatmeal.

False claims based on flawed science never helped anybody.

Experts have been saying for decades that solar, wind and electric will save the planet from the problems associated with petroleum.

Stay tuned for those same experts to warn against solar, wind and electric.

All this doesn’t even begin to enter the arena of economics – cost of design, manufacture, implementation, etc. And of course, we all know that the devices that are designed to save America will not be designed, patented or manufactured in America.

When are Americans going to learn to stop listening to ‘experts’ and use common sense once again?

It’s called “subsonic noise”. Many people are affected by it. Pumps, compressors, jet engines, etc. often produce it. It is felt by the whole body rather than being heard by the ears. The complaints are usually described as: feeling nervous, jumpy, irritable, etc along with inability to sleep well and the associated health problems from that. I finally had to move after a supplemental power generator was installed approx 1.5 mi. from my home. I couldn’t enjoy my pool outside or sleep in my MBR which was on the generator side of my house. Fortunately, they usually didn’t operate it after 11:00PM or before 7:00 AM. If I tried to sleep past 7:00 in the AM, I usually woke within 30 min. due to bad dreams. Like the poor fellow above, my wife couldn’t sense it at all and my kids only a little. Unfortunately, no local laws can prevent the start up of one of these because various federal laws trump them. They are designed to supplement the grid during peak demand times and are no more than large jet engines driving a generator. They are usually located at the intersection of the power grid and nat. gas pipelines and can even be activated remotely with no one on site. They can also run on diesel when nat. gas gets too expensive. Actually, they are very inefficient and pollute more per killawatt than large scale power production plants. They are very lucrative for the private consortia who build them with the blessings and protection of the feds. If you hear of a “supplemental power generator” coming to your area, MOVE quickly before the property value drops. Real estate within a half mile usually is unfit for human habitation. I ended up doing a good deal of research on this and would like to hear from others who might have had similar experiences. (hasalley@gmail.com)

I am glad that I don’t live in Massachusetts but I am glad they exist as the vanguard. Their experience implementing their version of Obamacare and building “sustainable” energy gives everyone else the facts they need to decide whether they want to follow the same path.

There are data showing physical health implications from the low level vibrations of these turbines. The plaintiff’s should review the studies.

In the realm of harm from low-frequency noise emissions, psychological impacts are inseparable from physiological impacts. This should be readily apparent. Anxiety and stress are commonly manifested in physical symptoms such as increased heart rate and increased blood pressure.

If what you’re saying were true, by now Holland would have been pushed clear to Gibralter, with prevailing winds.

Sleep well knowing the future of the world was envisioned with the first propeller-driven beanie!

You are precisely correct, but it appears that we must learn this truth by
going through a severe economic decline resulting in massive social unrest,
and probably a civil war. Thanks to the MSM and Academia.

Funny. There are at least 50 turbines along a ridge in southern Wisconsin mixed with housing and no one complains a bit. Maybe it’s because of the money they all make selling electricity back to the monopoly electric company. In fact the whole township lives for free when it comes to electricity. Again I say nary a complaint.

Both Holland and large ranches in many countries have used small windmills
for centuries to provide water. All of these together do not represent the
energy of one modern wind farm. You must learn to take magnitude into
account. Incidentally, in Altamonte pass near San Francisco, many hundreds
of wind turbines were built a few decades back because of a tax incentive.
They have now been torn down or disabled.

not to mention the fact that too many of them are spinnin without being connected to the grid, reasearch it, there is half of a “windmill farm” in west texas that isnt providing power to the grid, talk about wasteful

If one person experiences a problem, and one person does not, so this is not an issue that both sides are right.

Can one imagine a scenario where one person has reactions to a new drug and one person does not and the FAA sahying that both sides are right? The drug would be banned.

So what gives? Is wind power supposed to overrule health issues because not all people are affected.

they’re so liberal, give them all the wind machines you can! Load them up with “green stuff”, they deserve it!

I would say Mr. Neil Anderson has a serious mental problem with a calendar written on like that. Clear signs of emotional instability. And media Hype

Heather, simply Google “low-frequency noise problems”. You will find plenty of peer-reviewed studies attesting to serious and even severe health problems that may result from low-frequency noise emissions.

In WWII, Nazi Germany utilized severe low-frequency noise (infra-noise) as an instrument of torture. You can Google that also.

Boy the LIES flying here. Ive stood right next to these things on a wind farm and can barely hear them. If the sounds were 120 dB or higher (threshold of human hearing damage) I might buy some of this crap, but, Im not (buying ANY of it). Crap= sounds outside of human hearing causing damage.

PLEEZE dont think everyone is stupid…

Its called PSYCHOSOMATIC (its all in their heads) or just plain psychotic…

No credibility here:

““The existing peer-reviewed studies suggest that there are no health effects associated with the sound and noise from wind turbines,” McGlinchey said. “That being said, people clearly experience symptoms. People have headaches, people have their sleep disturbed, people are not living well next to them in some situations. In some situations they are. So, both sides are right.””

Stating that some people experience symptoms for NO VALID REASON proves they have screws loose or are lying. People can invent anything in their heads.

As a physicist, I am very alarmed that Science has returned to the Dark Ages. Real Science requires verification of conclusions by independent experiments, not just opinions. Today, Science is driven by the quest for government grants, which requires getting the approval of scientifically incompetent bureaucrats by telling them what they want to hear. “Peer Reviewed” has no credibility enhancement anymore, if it ever did. Honesty and experiment are the pre-requisite for truth. Not Green Thinking for sure.

Heres the REAL test. Blind study. Put them in a quiet room or with ear muffs, along with testing as to whether they experience symptoms based on when the mill runs or not.

OOPS, thats a SCIENTIFIC study that exposes cracpots like this…

Wrong. Every one of the turbines brought online in west Texas is on the ERCOT grid. Texas leads the nation in wind power and continues to set records every month. To quote a rancher who was asked if the turbine noise bothered her? “Honey, that’s just the sound of money.”

Get some autistic kids and scatter them around the area. When they start to scream bloody murder you know that the subsonic sound has reached their location. An autistic brain is more sensitive to much of this sound/vibration stuff as most equipment meant to meter the effects.

These comments are amusing. NIMBY. Keep in perspective that there were similar complaints on radio antennae in the 1920s and 1930s, and people receiving signals in their fillings.

Since I moved from Boston to Texas, I can tell you that Texas will be more than happy to sell you wind energy, natural gas or oil at $110 a barrel. Or you can send you money to Libya, Venezuela, or Iraq for the $110 oil.

We’re producing wind energy down here for a few cents per kW/h, so let us make it for you. Heaven forbid that Massachusetts figures out how to make their own energy.

Payoff is 8 years, life expectancy is 13. such mills are experiencing catastrophic and extremely expensive failures. Profit margin = thin, they use thousands of gallons of oils and greases that the whacko greenies dont know/talk about, and they require NG generators to operate when the wind is down.

As far as power production, they are a joke. They require double conversion (Siemens units at least) since teh blade speed is variable (convert to DC, then invert to 60 cycle AC compatible with the power lines) I dont have exact efficiency numbers, but at those power levels, each conversion is probably not more than 50% efficient.

What a WASTE of money, and yes, its another of Obamas farces.

The graduates of Harvard only accomplisments are to get an exec job via the Harvard Ol Boy Network, or get elected President of the US. Those who are smart drop out, like Gates and the Facebook guy. Academia is now a PC Cult with no respect for reality. Bad background, from which few recover.

There are only 3 reasons why a windmill is not turning. 1: No wind 2: It has broken down and there is no tax breaks for spare parts and labor to fix it. 3: They are producing TOO much electric, which can not be sent back to the power generation without tripping the breakers on the transformers. This is redundant power and is sending us back to the dark ages.

Junk science and plaintiff’s lawyers are a recipe for disaster. Lawyers create all sorts of phantom problems so that they can sue and get rich: (1) mold scare (2) toyota acceleration scare (3) silicon breast implant scare, etc, etc. And I’m not saying there isn’t something to each of these problems, it is just that the lawyers will blow the problems to about 10,000,000 times there real effect in order to whip people into a lawsuit frenzy so that they can file lawsuits and extract settlements before the truth comes out….

Key sentence in this story – The existing peer-reviewed studies suggest that there are no health effects associated with the sound and noise from wind turbines,” McGlinchey said.

We gotta rely on real science and not politically and plaintiff lawyer-motivated junk science. Get a grip people.

Just because there is no discernable noise does not mean there is No noise? There are high frequencys that can drive a person insane and still affect the hearing! Like the flourescent light bulb has been blamed for serious side effects and it can affect a persons behavior? No different here? Sometimes ones theory cannot be proven though right on the mark (target?) There are many unexplained mysteries in our world? Take OUR Gov/ment? There’s a MYSTERY!!!!????

A greenie gets his come-upence
The town is stupid enoughto spend money like that
deserves the reputation.

you can’t fix stupid

My ears ring all the time and I do not live anywhere close to a wind turbine. Of course it only takes one person to make claims of damage and others will jump on the bandwagon to get in on the publicity. One of the largest wind farms in ther USA is located about 25 miles from where I live and I have traveled to this location and I have heard no noise unless I was right under the wind turbine blades while they were running. It was only a soft whoosh at best. Even then it was possible to carry on a conversation at normal levels while standing there. Yes, some of the old early model ones located in California made some noise that could be heard a distance away. They have several of these things located right in downtown London England in operation when I was there a couple years ago. Some people will complain about just about anything if given a chance and I believe this is just one of those instances.

All true Jaom.

But I don’t necessarily want my nipples to glow in the dark from living too close to a nuke plant. YaknowwhatiMean?

There are complete assemblies being manufactured here in the U.S. now.

who claimed that he could no longer *********. He blamed it on the U.S. Navy.

But it’s clean! Obongo told us so.

“Ever wonder about the people who live near the oil-fired electric plant in Sandwich?
Or the nuclear plant in Plymouth?”

Please enlighten us. You make yourself sound like the expert so please educate us all on what has happened to the health and well being of residents near the nuclear plant in Plymouth. Or any nuclear plant in the U.S. Please provide links to the studies that prove any negative effects to these residents.

I’m willing to bet that you’re one of the people who pushed to get this tower installed. Why don’t you give your name? Are you a local elected official? Who else would just list off bullet points about how this is not harming anyone? Only a politician would ramble off something like “The Town’s noise study shows WIND1 complies with state law. The Falmouth board of health concluded there’s no health risk.” You should post comments with your real name so your constituents truly know where you stand. C’mon, man up! Or woman up (Heather Harper)!

I do nopt believe the story about a six foot high pile of dead birds surrounding the base of the turbine. The velocity of the blades is slowest close to the hub located directly above the base. The velocity of the blades farther out towards the ends of the blades is highest.This is where a bird would stand the highest chance of flying into a blade and becomming beheaded, or bewinged in flight.

I asked one of the engineers at a state wind generator test site near Amarillo Texas how many birds they found dead every year at each wind turbine. He said some years they will find two, or three at most, some years none. Of course those in opposition to the wind turbines will always say that the engineer or I, or probably both of us are lying about this very low mortality rate.

A welfare housing project went up on my street…theres noise,theres pounding,..I CANT SLEEP EITHER because of the noise 24/7 I HAVE MOOD SWINGS TOO when i go to work and the morning and all the project people are still sleeping.

Want to trade the windmill for a welfare project next to your house????

Industrial parks are zoned as such for good reason.
But it’s acceptable to plant these stupid things in residential areas, in effect turning them into industrial parks? There is a whole lot of corrupting going on to pull this off……

Twice as many wind turbines will produce twice the power 42% of the time. Maybe twice the power is more than can be used at any given time. You do not build wind turbines where the wind seldom blows.

Have a buddy that installed 3 of these. The noise does get mind-boggling after awhile but the main problem is up-keep. He has to have a crew of 3 on call 24/7 because of ‘problems’. Just ask Spain, they put in a bunch off the coast and are always having problems with them. Nice idea. Pain in but.

Dear Retdetvet: you should talk to your neighbors more often. At least 7 of them for now are suing the U of D and the town to stop the turbine there. I was down in Lewes last fall and although it may not seem that loud on campus, when you get out at about 1/3 of a mile, that thing roared.

http://www.wind-watch.org/news/2011/02/14/group-of-7-lewes-homeowners-is-set-to-fight-ud-wind-turbine/

Maybe raking feathers is one of those “green jobs” we keep hearing about….

Is it possible for the residents of the town to elect different members of the town council who will take the action they desire, or do they just want to complain about something. Could it just be that there is nothing very exciting ever going on in that part of the county and this problem just happened to come along at the right time for its entertainment value?

So called Greens think renewable energy is soooo great, until it’s in their backyard. And until the “no carbon” crowd gets behind nuclear (the cleanest, cheapest per GW power there is), I just can’t take them seriously.

INDUSTRIAL WIND TURBINES DO NOT PROVIDE RENEWABLE ENERGY!!!
To quote John Barwis, an energy expert: “Won’t wind turbines decrease emissions of ash, sulfur and nitrogen, heavy metals, and CO2? Won’t we enjoy health benefits, and be doing our part to “save the planet”? Well actually, no. Fluctuations in wind speed cause variations in electrical yield from wind turbines, and these variations do not match electricity demand. So no matter how many windmills are installed, conventional power plants must provide 100 percent backup capacity to avoid power shortages. These backup plants must ramp their output up or down to offset changes in wind speed. Changing the output of a fossil-fuel generation system has a negative impact on its efficiency. When running below optimal output, THEY BURN MORE FUEL per unit of electricity generated. At some level of efficiency loss, the extra fossil fuel consumed becomes greater than the fuel saved from using wind turbines. This is the so-called “turning point,” where the reduction in CO2 emissions becomes zero.” THEY AREN’T GREEN! They are a waste of taxpayer money. More than half the cost of these monstrosities is paid for with tax dollars, they would not exist without them. Industrial wind receives the most taxpayer subsidy with solar and nuclear coming in a distant second and third. Energy conservation such as mandating LED lighting in government buildings nationwide, etc. would save more electricity than a plethora of wind turbines will ever provide. Plus, CHECK OUT BLOOM BOXES: http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=6816773n – this energy producing technology actually holds a lot of promise. We shouldn’t waste trillions on a wind energy, a technology first introduced by ENRON and then sold off to GE.

Google “Captains of Subsidy” video. See what green energy is really about…and how expensive it is

If one moves next to anything that is already in place, then they accept whatever downside may exist in return for paying a reduced price for the property. But if one builds a nusiance in an established area, then the nusiance cost is part of the overall cost of the construction, and those whose property values suffer should be paid by those who are promoting the effort. But fanatics of the Cult of Green of course never want to pay for anything . They just want to feel like they are saving humanity even though they have no qualifications to save anything. A dose of Dr. Feelgood for free motivates these pathetic souls.

Wait till someone with some scientific background in harmonics discovers what the vibrations are doing to the area.

I lived within eyesight – lucky not in hearing distance – of the Altamone wind farm near Livermore, California, about 50 miles east of San Francisco. During the day when I could see them, most of the time they were motionless. They seemed to run a bit better at night, when the power was surplus to needs. Even with government subsidies, the operating companies kept going bankrupt. Wind and solar make no sense, economically or environmentally. Nuclear makes sense. It’s amazing how we avoid the obvious.

Expand I lived within eyesight – lucky not in hearing distance – of the Altamont wind farm near Livermore, California, about 50 miles east of San Francisco. During the day when I could see them, most of the time they were motionless. They seemed to run a bit better at night, when the power was surplus to needs. Even with government subsidies, the operating companies kept going bankrupt. Wind and solar make no sense, economically or environmentally. Nuclear makes sense. It’s amazing how we avoid the obvious.

Do you suppose that these pathetic green sociology majors realize that solar and wind power are the result of a nuclear reaction in the sun? As is nearly all of earth’s energy except nuclear. Even geothermal is mostly the result of the nuclear decay near the earth’s mantle.

Good analysis m. but let’s not forget that the blades also kill birds. Total numbers are staggering but suppressed by the media. Audubon society knows. That’s why they are neutral on the turbines. They won’t go negative because they are afraid of losing donations. Windmills are also not that safe. A worker near Goldendale WA was killed while installing a wind generator a few years back. I only learned of it because I was driving through the area and it was covered by the local news. There was no coverage beyond the local area. Probably been a few more fatalities like this but good luck digging up the information. In the meantime, after half a century of operation, we wait fearfully for the first radiation fatality in a U.S. based Commercial Nuclear Power plant or waste handling facility.

The cheapest energy source in America is coal. The most expensive is wind turbines that threaten to substantially devalue Nantucket and Nantucket Sound and cape properties. Who are the dumb asses approving these economic and efficiency formulas.

AMERICA IS ABOUT MORE FOR LESS NOT LESS FOR MORE!

Send the Socialists and Communists back to England on a slow ship. It didn’t work for the Pilgrims, and it won’t work for America. What the hell is wrong with you people. Get a clue or get out.

A concerned and patiotic citizen of the United States of America

You will be waiting a very long time. No Green idea makes sense because Greens don’t have the knowledge required to produce economic solutions to anything. That requires engineers, inventors, and, above all, free enterprise to weed out the stupid ideas that are implemented by stealing from the taxpayers. Initial investors want to make money, and they are the ones who really check out all the crazy ideas in circulation at any given time. When the government agrees to subsidize something then the risk is removed and the gates open for the whackos like wind, solar, tidal. The idea of these power sources has been around for centuries, but except for a few unique situations, never made financial sense as many wannabe green entrepreneurs have found out for centuries. But apparently the stupid will always be with us thinking they have some new idea, and then go on to repeat the same old failure.

Wouldn’t that be child abuse? Shall I call CPS (child protective services)? Please provide your name and phone number.

I know, have you read about the coming unparalleled solar flares? They are warning people in Australia to double up on the zinc oxide. They are so severe they are threatening our satellites and communications.

I hope the flares fry the turbines. Climate change is a 100% naturally occurring phenom which has covered the earth with fire, water and ice for millions of years.

Only self-righteous, mostly fallen of faith in god control freaks are hellbent on blaming others while they buy “carbon credits” to rationalize and assuage their guilt for their jet set, addictive consumption and in many cases addictive consumerism.

Environmentalism in the extreme has divided America and its indoctrination has destroyed children’s ability to discern.

People make very bad pseudo gods and earth guardians. Go back to minding your own business, ride a bike, buy American made goods and turn the light off when you leave the room as I do and you will do more toward preserving the earth and our resources than all the mad chatter and religiosity of the green fear and destruction cult.

Best comment on the board. Tell it like it is, Gary.

Wasting taxpayer’s money on wind power, yet another violation of our rights. Add it to the list of gov’t violations of our right:
They violate the 1st Amendment by placing protesters in cages, banning books like “America Deceived II” and censoring the internet.
They violate the 2nd Amendment by confiscating guns.
They violate the 4th and 5th Amendment by molesting airline passengers.
They violate the entire Constitution by starting undeclared wars for foreign countries.
Impeach Obama and sweep out the Congress.
(Last link of Banned Book):
http://www.iuniverse.com/Bookstore/BookDetail.aspx?BookId=SKU-000190526

It is because they are, as Jerry Clowers used to say, “educated far beyond their intelligence”.

I think having nipples that glow in the dark would be quite a distinction!!

Liberals … do as I say, not as I do.

I agree with you, but come, on … people get killed working in coal, hydroelectric, solarelectric, and even nuclear plants.

I agree, I was a Nuke electrician on Nuclear Subs for 10 years and cannot believe that we have not went to more Nuclear plants in the US. I have also driven across Kansas many times (I live in Colorado and my parents live in Kansas) and am always amazed at the number of wind turbines on the hills there that never seem to be turning.

Who cares if it kills a bird. over time birds as well as other animals adjust their there paths to avoid such places on their own

Just think, one single reactor, perfectly silent nuclear plant would take the place of 718 of these and not have to worry if the wind blows or not.

“Precautionary principle, rather than a fight for scientific one-upmanship.” Gee, at the risk of offending you, what a frightening suggestion that is. Your so-called “precautionary principle” can be used to subjectively justify just about anything and “scientific one-upmanship” sounds like a neat way to demean the use of scientific fact. What utter nonsense!

“In all my searching of peer-reviewed scientific studies, I have been unable to find the unequivocal proof of health problems you mention.” Then it must not exist anywhere in the universe.

One generally must look in order to find.

Agreed, all desenter must die.

Wind turbines are an eyesore and visual pollution; overall they are not an efficient source of energy and have a “footprint” hundreds of times bigger per output of energy than nuclear or conventional power plants. They are just another example of greedy corporate interests manipulating the tax code and economic development incentives to get rich off things the free market would never advance.

The companies that push for these special tax breaks and economic incentives and the Congress and state legislatures that approve them should be ashamed. I hope those suing will be successful in ridding their community of this source of blight and visual pollution. Destroying a neighborhood’s quality of life is not worth it just so a few do gooders can feel like they helped save the environment.

Yeah, we don’t want that macho scientific one-upmanship. Nosireee.

When all liberals are dead.

Was that decision based on scientific one-upmanship?

“The existing peer-reviewed studies suggest that there are no health effects associated with the sound and noise from wind turbines,” The problem with a lot of “peer-reviewed” studies is that such studies often–if not usually– produce the results the buyer wants.

“I believe…that they are experiencing something that is very real to them,” Harper said. In other words their objections are imaginary.

Tear the damn thing down.

Then it must not exist!

They forgot to do an impact statement on the sea run snail darter and now it is headed for extinction.

It amazes me when I hear people complain about wind turbine noise like it’s something new. Are you about to say no one knew prior to April that the noise was going to drive you insane? Was it visual impairment, stupidity, or blind allegiance to being superior to others by being green that kept you from the truth? I dont want to sound too mean but seriously it’s time for a reality check. If the technology can’t compete without being subsidized by someone its really NOT superior to the technology you are trying to get rid of. Hey you want to get rid of evil oil and thats cool and when you find something truly better (superior or equal to) the entire world will beat a path to your door. We all want that. And do some thinking please. With the kind of money that’s at stake energy research doesn’t need to be “subsidized” either. There are lots of very smart people searching for THAT solution 20 hours a day 7 days a week.

Government Money ….because the numbers don’t work without tax breaks.

So a self-professed “environmentalist” hates the windmill? The hypocrisy underwhelms me.

If it had been a bunch of conservatives complaining about the noise, he would have been screaming how they want to destroy the planet. I take that back – conservatives wouldn’t have wasted the money on a freaking windmill in the first place. A huge money-losing sinkhole.

“The existing peer-reviewed studies. . .” Let me guess, it was peer-reviewed by Michael Mann or Phil Jones. When an environmentalist (aka “The lying Left”) says “peer-reviewed” it almost certainly means they are lying. There is no science or factual basis for environmentalism. It’s all just a front for Marxism and absolutely nothing more. If you don’t know that by now, you have not been paying attention or you just aren’t too bright.

Where? And who owns them?

GE took the stimulus money and built a plant in China. And The Precedent was good with that apparently.

Yep. Good old Warren Buffet. Even he isn’t rich enough to build these things without your tax money.

I’m thinking this website needs the sarc/sarc-off tag.

They were going to spend ten million, so the windmill saved five million dollars. Don’t you know how to do Demo-math?

Sorry you Green fruitcakes. There is no NIMBY allowed to get out of the crap you’ve been pushing on everyone else.

Nothing like green energy.

Michael, I used to commute from the Bay area to LA twice a week. I drove through the passes there. You are correct. Almost NEVER were they turning and generating electricity. TOTAL waste of taxpayer $.

GET SOME EARPLUGS MORON!!!!!!

SHUT THIS FOOLS POWER OFF PERMANENTLY!!!!

THEN LETS SEE IF the NOISE STILL BOTHERS HIM!!!!!

You have a right of peaceful enjoyment of your property. Tear it down!

Exactly right. Being a physicist, I decided to investigate climatology to see if it was a predictive science which means that it starts from laws, always true in a well described domain, and then uses deductive logic and mathematics to derive facts of interest. Should any of the facts not stand up to reality then the laws are wrong. Climatology is not a deductive science I quickly discovered. The nearest laws are exactly those of physics which apply to everything of a material nature. The problem is that to solve the physics of something like the climate of the earth is such an incredibly complex task that it will always be beyond our computational capabilities. So all we can do is what the farmers’ almanac does–note some weather patterns that seem to be followed frequently by others and “predict” those. The effect of one variable like carbon dioxide on the atmosphere is but one of millions of things that affect it. The final result is the algebraic sum of all of these. Nobody can contemplate this and seriously decide to solve its nature a century from now. Either the leaders of climatology are merely stupid, or they are con men. They are an insult to science and have set back by centuries its hard fought effort to gain respect as our best source of truth. I have yet to read any one of them who showed he understood physics, which is the starting point. Mann, Jones and similar crap, and their institutions which gave them cover for the financial grants brought in, should be joining Bernie Madoff while the universites are downgraded far below the University of Phoenix.

Poor Mr. Anderson, why doesn’t he just move to the Kennedy Compound. It’s still nice and quiet. As always, Liberals can’t eat their own cooking.

THIS IS SO WRONG TO BLAME PRESIDENT BARRY! IN ADDITION TO THE WINDMILLS, HE’S GIVEN US THE CHEVY VOLT, ERIC HOLDER, CZARS, JUST LOTS OF GOOD PEOPLE AND IDEAS THAT’S MOVING THIS COUNTRY FORWARD.

Why is it that MA is so full of nut jobs, and criminals like Teddy Kennedy, yet people think they have great schools. MIT once was, but Harvard has always been out of touch with reality. A place for the children of the wealthy, and now many AA tokens, to become indoctrinated in PCism.

Get some Bose noise canceling headphones (they work incredibly well in this application) and apply the concept to the home if it is so bad. You and Bose could have a rich future.

Its a government scam which benefits the operators and manufacturers with lucrative subsidies and tax benefits while not lowering the cost of electricity to local citizens, What’s worse than the West Falmouth installation is the planned massive development planned for Vineyard Sound. Government support for such projects is designed to benefit a special interest group at the expense of the public.

GE manufactures blades in Newton, IA and Aberdeen, SD.

GE and Obama….Perfect together!
All anyone needs to do is take a drive on US15 from Vegas to the coast of CA.
There are literally THOUSANDS of windmills across the, once beautiful, mountain ranges.
At any given time, only 10%-15% are actually producing! The rest are either broken or not spinning. Drill baby drill!!!

Who said that it was just wavy.
Then the reporter puked in the bucket

Sounds like a giant version of those “mole chaser” windmills that you place in your yard. They do the same thing, the low level frequency chases them out of the yard.

Just keep voting democrats and democrats will put up all the wind machines they want. Why do you think people were getting all worked up over the Cap and Trade bill not to mention the billions and billions of dollars Obama has spent on energy projects. The technology is not there to go to other sources of energy. It is not there, so no matter what a politician tells you, it is not there.

Be careful what you wish for lefties,that ole feel good enviro-mentalism has come home to roost. How many of you will continue to vote D because it is surely the fault of Bush or Sarah Palin.

The next time you see a enviro-nazi demonstrating against clean, safe, nuclear power – fight back. We only have one viable option at this point and we’ll be forced there eventually, but we will have wasted decades being held captive by green terrorists and other special interests. Had enough?

Forget about the noise- take a look at the economics! You owe $5mm on this thing and it only returns about $375,000 per year. That is a very low payout rate and very few if any responsible private organizations wold invest money in this project

So how is all that Hope and Change (…and change…. and yet more change) working for you all, eh? Get over yourselves, you wanted this, your beloved Zerobama wants it, his minions in the EPA want it…so now you’re stuck with it. Yup…hope. …and change. I’ll bet you’re hoping for a little change right about now.

Having lived with tinitis since the army, I can attest to the difficulty people must have with ringing in their ears. It is claustrophobic and highly unsettling to say the least. At least these people have a cure. Move the thing out of ear shot.

Well Rockman you’re right on both parts, the disaster and the too late, and there doesn’t seem like there’s a damm thing we can do about it.

And what might those golden plovers think as they fly into the arms of the machines of eco -madness?

Oh well. Theres ALWAYS Coal….,

and the oil to lubricate them comes from the Middle East..

“luser of a windmill is going to “save” $375K a year? But it COSTS $5 million?” Should have just invested it in an oil company.

Where’s the new nuclear plants? Nuclear is cheap, safe, clean, quiet and available 24/7.
Seabrook was designed for 2 reactors and the second was only partially built. Maybe there is room at Pilgrim for a second reactor (the modern ones are even safer).

With gas crashing upward to 6-10 dollars a gallon this should destroy the cape spring and summer economies. But that’s OK because they’ll need less electricity which is good to the tiny green minds.

They’ll be another government program to remediate the debacle.

In the meantime the big success is the Volt with 281 units sold in February. The government though has orders for thousands which will solve that.

Anyone see a pattern here?

Posting precision equipment, i.e. turbine and gearsets, on the end of a giant stick and waving it around in the air is not a recipe for operational longevity. The wind turbine idea is a farce. Unfortunately the U.S. has become the land of farce and consequence.

I’ve got the solution!! SUPERFUND money for liberals who cannot live near their green agenda. C’mon ‘bama, these are your supporters, make it financially, ahem, worth their while.

Ever notice how the red states are the recipients of green agenda? Exploit and pollute rural America so the coasts can have cheap energy (or at least the feeling of it.)

I’ve lived in the “fly over zone” my whole life. I’m an educated healthcare professional who believes in rural health. I practice what I preach. I know it is a hard concept for our friends from Massachusetts to understand. Hard medicine to swallow isn’t it?

Yup, and the envirowhackjobs love it. People, other than thenselves, are “inconvenient.” It is not the turbine they hate, it is the fact that folks won’t freeze in the dark because of them and the goal of these Luddites is to get rid of people!

Okay, no problem, remove the turbine and construct a nuclear power plant. Or even better a coal burner. That’s all you whining sissy gays deserve anyway.

Yea sure, and after the windmills are banned, what’s next on the “we can’t possibly use THAT list”

If I found a magic rock to which a pair of wires conld be connected and electrical power withdrawn, you Luddites would find something wrong with it. You don’t hate turbines, you hate people.

Next, we will ban cities, because THEIR lights ruin the sky view. Lard, the Luddites are transparent.

Where’s my gun? Let’s start the civil war against the MSM and academia now!

Of course not when the costs in Grants, subsidized loans and inflated forced resale rates are factored back to analyze real costs we discover that “Green” facism is just an enormous taxpayer rip-off. Of course what’s important is a bunch of smug morally superior homeowners and civil servants “feel good”; the rel goal of green power.

It’s all progressive economic onanism.

guy sounds like a wacko he should take his meds

I’ve read this is happening to residents all across the country, where they have put these up. Also have read that they leak oil.

This winter in England, all their wind mills froze up and their mandated new furnaces also froze up, they had to get energy from France!

What if their nearest neighbor had said NO?

I would be interested in knowing if these wind mills were made in China…..most are.

Way to go environmentalists, you just created a system that doesn’t work well, that affects residents and gave China more jobs!

elitists. . . .these turbines are all over west texas now, spoiling, in the opinion of some, a beautiful view and breathtakng sunsets.

northeast liberals want “green” as long as it is not in their own backyard. gth

Bird kills are almost non existent for turbines on monopoles

I hear they scare the whales away. Don’t know, never asked one.

And the costs associated with manufacture and maintenance is not made up in revenue. Wind Turbines are way more expensive than any other form of energy generation. But I guess so long as the Anointed One’s friends are making money off of us, it is OK?

They’re a blight on your property values, which in the end concerns the psudoenviroweenies more than anything else. Oh daaaaaarling, our OCEAN VIEW!!

This has been my contention for years–that the long-term effects on the environment have been ignored or neglected. We think sources such as wind and sun are inexhaustable, the same way the nations forests were considered when America was being developed. Yes, in Arizona, we have thousands of square miles of flat desert land drenched in sunshine 300+ day a year. So, if covered with solar panels (a low-energy density solution), how does one keep them clean from the inevitable dust accumulation, therby dramatically reducing their electrical output? Window washers by the hundreds? And where does the water some from? You see the problem…

I agre that nuclear energy is by far the best environmental solution because of it’s high energy density, and the fact that we have the expertise for safe design. Please note that with a mandate of zero radioactive emmissions imposed by regulation, most coal-fired generating plants would fail that mandate in that they emit small amounts of radioactivity in the air that’s contained in the coal.

They are real rough on flying pigs, I hear.

Do you reckon it would also protect me from Leftist drivel?

Snopes says NO, envirolier

and if they’re spinning, the generator/engine is wearing itself out, for no apparent purpose.

Who cares if birds are killed? Well the environmentalists used to, till they saw their dream of hundreds of wind mills.

Environmentalists don’t actually care that much about the environment, they like the power they feel, when they see they have pushed their policy off onto the public.

The junk and garbage illegal aliens leave in the desert is horrible, you never see them out there cleaning it up, nor do you hear them complain about what is being done to the desert, or the mountains where illegals grow marijuana.

All they want is to know is, they have forced their insane agenda onto more of us than there are of them!

You should have taken an economics 101 course somewhere. Few investments have a one year payback. Back to community college with you. Or is it high school?

The key to a happy life in America is identify how and when the government is going to screw you and act before it can happen. They should have moved when they first heard the news of wind turbines in their area.

The irony here is killing me. I don’t think GBH expected this many comments from people that disagree with their agenda. I wonder how long before the posts are not allowed.The racist, facist left does not like open discussion.

Wind poer can be doen correctly . It cannot be done wiht cheap turbines form China . Teh ones built here at least the one I knoe of ar no better. The turbnies in Hull are Vestas, the best of the bunch. the noise in not even perceptible at 800 feet.

TThe Law of Unexpected Consequences strikes again.

Some years ago a bunch of Tree Huggers got together to bury a car to make the air cleaner. Last Rites for the car were postponed because the Tree Huggers got caught in a massive traffic jam of their own making. Something backfires every time these dipsticks try anything.

How’s your Volt running?

Go Nuclear!!!

I tend to beleive the mainte3nance workers here. Stories such as 6 fot high piles of bird bodies have to be myth.
I oppose the wind turbines because they are a waste of tax-payer’s dollars.

And what FACTS do YOU have to dispute it????? I’m not interested in your half witted opinion.

Another example of knee jerk eco science. Time to stop these green weenies from destroying America in the name of “progress”. BTW another example of noise pollution that adversely affecst health is the low frequency loud booming bass emitted from the autos of urban gangsters.

Get some pictures for us, I find your “opinion” without a factual foundation.. Facts, remember those? YOu may think you can save the world by nmaking it up as you go along, but it ain’t that easy.

There are blades being manufactured in Fort Madison Ia.

Bla bla bla,your bias is showing. Spare us the psudo science technobabble.

Isn’t the QUALITY of someone’s life more important than saving the COST of electricity?

here’s an idea:

MOVE

I hate to urinate in the Falmouth Town Councils Cherrios, but I think they have been had. I’m a Marine Project Manager in the Offshore Wind business and am knowledgable regarding “installed cost”. Land based Wind Generators should come in at about $1Mil per installed MW. Falmouths 1.65 MW Unit at $5Mil doesnt make sense. I realize it is a “one off” and would require a Trandformer Station, etc. but even then the numbers don’t jive.

Just as Caliph al-Bama wills it, may it be done (by order of the Prophet). al-Bama!

“Condor Cuisinarts” produce “Shredded Tweet”

Another “GREEN” idea that was launched solely because it was green. 20 year payback that may never happen. Just like CFL bulbs that fill our landfills with mercury. As long as it “looks good” right? This is what our left-run public education system gets us.

quit whining you tree hugging bastard…this is what you wanted; this is what you got!!!

I’ve been an environmentalist longer than most. An early member of the Sierra Club, avid backpacker etc. No doubt I notice the changes caused by encroachment of civilization, I advocate for better stewardship and get mad as hell when I see trash left in the woods. Nevertheless, those of us who care recognize that our enovornmental movement has been usurped by radical leftists who see it as a tool subvert America into their vision of a marxist/socialist utopia. They could not give a crap about the environment. So everytime I see one of these wackos pretending to care (Al Gore) I know there is a special place in h*ll for them.

It doesn’t take much in the way of brains to recognize that when you trash the economy the environment isn’t far behind. After all if you can’t afford fuel for the winter and food on the table what’s next? Wood in the fireplace and ……

Wind turbines are a huge scam. From the Energy Information Administration oil & gas subsidies 25 cents per MWH while wind & solar $24 per MWH (96 times as much!!!). Plus we are getting hosed on electrical rates. Look at Cape Wind project and recent articles in The Boston Herald. Global Warming!!! Wake up. Look at the geologic history. A palentologist here thinks the “global warming” scam artist have little knowledge of the three past ice ages and several mass extinctions of the species. This is Obamanomics and socialism at its worst.

Texas has enough Wind Mills to off set ONE 1000 Megawatt Nuclear power plant. They are online and generating that much power.

Why is there no audio of the noises they are complaining about? It seems it would be important to the argument and somebody would have recorded it by now.

Remember how Ted Kennedy pushed for these idiotic backwards wind mills as long as they were in someone else’s back yard? These ugly things are an eysore and the money saving is nothing but an illusion (or delusion). There’s always an unintended consequence to the libtards’ “brilliant ideas”, but hey, their intentions are good.

The blades are coming in from Brazil. GE built a plant there

That explains the blackouts we had this past month.

Al Gore and his lib pals are so heavily invested in this redistribution of wealth from the energy business there is no way these windmills are going away. They don’t work well anyway. I know, I am in the business. 60% of our nations energy comes from coal. Gore isn’t making any money off it so CLOSE down those steam plants! His plan is to use politics to regulate coal out of the industry and replace it with these damn worthless eye poluting wind mills. We could be bleeding out our ears from the windmills and they will still put them up…

This is just the beginning. The U.S. govt.has plans for developers to build windmills over more than 2,000 nautical square miles in the oceans off of our shorelines. How much wildlife will die? http://www.gloucestertimes.com/local/x415202598/Comment-time-extended-for-ocean-wind-project
In England: The UK doesn’t have enough money to bury the cables leading to the windmills so the cables will be above ground. Won’t that be pretty?.Citizens have been informed if there is no wind there will be no electricity. Deal with it! Meanwhile the UK is financing the building of coal mines in China. They closed their coal mines and put thousands out of work.

Buy Warren IS rich enough to build them without government money. He is just smart enough not to turn down free money.

We have been LIED to about how efficent they are. This is a joke.

ya’all are missing the point…. This man Anderson is vested in solar energy and is now realizing that the competition is actually … well competition. I REALLY doubt his (shamless) plight…..

The old fast turning windmills like those around Palm Springs CA make a huge amount of blade noise. I have worked at that wind farm and can report this from personal experience. The new slow turning windmills like those in western Minnesota and Falmouth make a huge amount of gear noise. I wouldn’t want one anywhere near my house. There are also lots of pictures online showing big windmill fires when the gearbox overheats and starts burning. Building these things near homes is a big mistake – they ruin the environment for a 1/2 mile radius with their noise pollution. Visit one if you disagree with me.

Do they kill mosquitoes? I’ll pay to have one by my house if they do.

Really? Where are they? I want to see them. I’ve lived in Texas for 52 years and I haven’t heard anything about them. If you are talking about the wind farm in west Texas, last I heard they are there, but they aren’t even connected to anything. People, stop buying into this hoax.

Look at it from a Liberal point of view… GE/GM did sell five Volt’s last month. Combined it is something like 140 mile charge and 200 mph. what other car can do that?

You are correct Norman. Al Gore and his lib pals are so heavily invested in this redistribution of wealth from the energy business there is no way these windmills are going away. They don’t work well anyway. I know, I am in the business. 60% of our nations energy comes from coal. Gore isn’t making any money off it so CLOSE down those steam plants! His plan is to use politics to regulate coal out of the industry and replace it with these damn worthless eye poluting wind mills. We could be bleeding out our ears from the windmills and they will still put them up…

NOT SO Texas Star. Texas has more energy than it needs normally so this electricity is sent elsewhere. When the snow doesn’t have them shut down that is…Al Gore and his lib pals are so heavily invested in this redistribution of wealth from the energy business there is no way these windmills are going away. They don’t work well anyway. I know, I am in the business. 60% of our nations energy comes from coal. Gore isn’t making any money off it so CLOSE down those steam plants! His plan is to use politics to regulate coal out of the industry and replace it with these damn worthless eye poluting wind mills. We could be bleeding out our ears from the windmills and they will still put them up…

And what happens to the birds habitat when the bulldozers come in? You are ignorant.

Some suggestions:
1. If you link everything you don’t like to Obama, it erodes any legitimate arguments. “My tooth aches because Obamacare” means you are a nut-job with an agenda. Not an intelligent individual with a thought.

2. You should not talk about financial return and complain about sourcing materials overseas in the same thread. Can’t have your cake and eat it too. Lower cost components come from competition, especially overseas. And I assure you that companies looking for better ROI look at overseas products to help do that. A corollary to that is the concern that our manufacturing is leaving the US — but ask any factory worker if they want their children to be doing the same job as they are, and most will say no. They want something better for them. But we gripe when those jobs go away. . .

3. I would love to see what Neil Anderson was crusading against before this. I guarantee it was something. The article sees him as a person who instantly had a problem shoved in his face. I assure you, he always has problems, the target of his ire is the only difference here.

What is true is dead birds and blades COVERED in bird shit that are useless because they are no longer aerodynamic. Efficency is cut in half!

Snopes is a leftist site. Period. What did you expect?

I seriously doubt the volt can go 200 miles per hour. Even with 40 miles per charge, it won’t do the vast majority of the nation any good, space wise. I would need a minimum of 150 miles per charge and a backup power source for it to be feasonable for me to use.

EXACTLY

Ha ha ha ha!!!!!!! It put the GREEN into Al Gores bank account. LOL

Interesting that Anderson owned a passive solar farm on Cape Cod.
Could that have anything to do with his antipathy towards wind turbines?
Quite likely!

How can they move? Who would buy their home?

They are spinning…thousands of them, uglier than hell near Sweetwater. At night there are thousands of humming red lights flashing on the towers as far as the eye can see in all directions. Get out more,jim

what a bunch of anuses. please, they had pathetic licves to begin with, now they should be happy they have something to bitch about. isn’t that the american dream? bitching & bloating.

Where are the environmentalists on the pollution these windmills are generating? Pollution can take many forms. The sound pollution is effecting the health of the residents nearby these giants. How about the light pollution from these at night? Some people move out to the countryside to escape the city lights, now with these 200 foot towers with their aircraft beacons ruin the night sky for some people?
How are they ensuring that these are not acting as Chop-O-Matic’s for the local bird population? I understand a bunch of wind turbines have been shutdown in California because they were chopping up birds… Environmentalist vs. Environmentalist, gotta love it!.

What a crock!

I hope anybody who is free to go outside unescorted realizes that Snopes is just a silly joke. Do people really believe there is an oracle that spouts only the truth. Good lord, that idea died with the anchient Greeks!

I say just cut off all electricity to these Northeast Red Commie Socialist Greenies. Let them live like the Pilgrims did. They are disgusting.

Liberalism once was a desirable goal in college. The idea was to teach a spectrum of ideas from the past, and teach people how to think and find information, and show how to spot phony arguments. But no conclusions or professorial opinions were allowed. Now it is just the opposite. An indoctrination into the cult religion of PCism with no value at all placed on what is real. Liberals never have ideas worthy of consideration because they are either too young and inexperienced, or if older, just plain dumb. Intelligence plus a few years in reality are the death of a liberal. Which makes old liberals, trying to regain the magic of the 60s, such pathetic creatures.

This would be the same David McGlinchey who works for Manomet Center for Conservation Sciences in Plymouth MA, an institution looking into erecting its own wind turbine(s).

McGlinchey seems to be channeling Dr, Robert McCunney, paid “expert” for AWEA, who claims that there is no direct (note the weasel word!) link between wind turbine noise and health effects.

You should realize that such a statistic is impossible to obtain. Just imagine the required tens of thousands of people hanging around all the windmills for years counting dead birds. Anybody seeing these people?

Those urban gangsters were not supposed to be here after they had access to the white man’s education. At least that is what the liberals told us back in the 50s. Just seems like liberals are wrong on everything. Wish they would start picking stocks, then I could make a fortune shorting those.

I think it has already started. The Middle East is heating up and there are enough camel folks here to get something going. I suggest we knock out all the liberal universites first, and then force the PC faculty to turn the cranks on human-driven electrical generators, sort of like galley slaves of old..Gets rid of a lot of pollution.

Most solar collectors are out of service within a year due to the crud buildup. After cleaning these things a few times, particularly those on the roof, most everyone just says “screw it” and returns to things that work. This happened in Florida in the 20s and again in California in the 80s. Nobody has an answer to that problem.

pro abortion, pro gay rights,

you forgot to add anti religious lunatic which all 3 are keeping me from switching from independent to republican.

True. And a lot of parts are manufactured in Ohio. Cardinal Fastener in Ohio increased its workforce by over 50% to meet demand for bolts. But the haters will hate no matter what the facts are. Maybe on new projects going forward more thought needs to go into siting, as this story points out. Or maybe we need funding for research into reducing buffeting. But there’s no doubt that creating jobs and reducing pollution is a good thing. I sometimes think that flood of haters in these kind of comment threads are people being paid by the fossil fuel oligarchs who hate nothing more than real competition and real markets. It turns out that the biggest recipient of government subsidies isn’t renewables it’s dirty fossil fuels, and that industry will do anything to maintain its grip on government handouts. If these rightwingers aren’t paid trolls, then they are fools who’ve been tricked into thinking cronyism and oligopoly are “free market” outcomes.

There’s a Siemans plant in Fort Madison. GE builds blades in Newton IA. GE may be constructing blades in Brazil too. So what? Wind power creates jobs in the US and provides a clean, modern energy supply. Again, the siting and buffeting may be an issue, but remember we’ve been literally blowing the tops off of purple mountains majesty to mine for coal, so there are huge negative externality issues with coal too.

Yet, the GOP House members just voted UNANIMOUSLY in favor of earmarks in the tax code for the oil industry. How do those numbers “work out”? The fact is that fossil fuels get far greater subsidies, especially when you include the costs associated with pollution as a subsidy. The fact is that the wind power industry is creating jobs and supplying clean power. That seems worth investing in. Meanwhile, the oil industry destroyed not only the jobs of gulf fishermen but nearly destroyed an entire way of life built around the ecology of those fisheries. Or have we already forgotten “spill baby spill”?

Actually this was a problem with the older designed blades at Altmont Pass, but not nearly as big a problem with the larger, slower moving blades. Bird mortality from windmills is a tiny fraction of mortality from cars and trucks plus windows on buildings.

What happens to bird habitat when we blow the top off of a mountain to mine coal?

Typical rightwinger. Your beliefs are unfalsifiable if you automatically discount any source that disagrees with them. Snopes does a good job knocking down urban myths. You just have to read what they say and what sources they cite and make up your own mind. Maybe they are wrong sometimes, but they are right a lot of the time. It’s a worthy source to check. But dismissing any source that disagrees with rightwing dogma or myths as “biased” is irrational.

Actually, US oil production peaked in the 70s. That’s why companies are pushing into risky and costly deep water drilling. Spill baby spill, remember that? If there was still “lots of it in the ground” then they wouldn’t be incurring the risk and cost of going out into the deep ocean. This is simple market economics. Setting aside disputes about the ecological costs, there are basic facts about limitation of supply.

The science of climate change is based on basic physics. Carbon traps heat. You can test and measure this in a laboratory.

Science has been so corrupted by the greed of those currently in Science that one can comission a study to find whatever results you want. They are simply hired guns like lawyers, with no sense of right and wrong. The only way to find out what is going on today is using Google and getting as many opinions from as many sources as possible. Then sift through these and draw your own conclusions. For me Windpower is a no brainer since I worked at Livermore Labs near the Altamont pass in California. Massive construction of turbines when a tax incentive made them attractive. But few worked, and in addition to the eyesore, when the government pulled their support they started coming down because buried in the fine print was a clause requiring the individual owner(s) to tear the things off the farmer’s land if they were not operational. The electricity they produced was even more expensive than solar so the investors were stuck with the junkyard fee. Lesson learned for a lot of people.

Climatologists use systems of differential equations to predictively model climate systems. You have confused weather and climate. You’re right that we can’t predict the weather accurately because of computational and observational constraints, but in fact the changes in general climatic patterns (as opposed to specific weather) that are being observed have been accurately predicted. The mathematical phenomena that allows us to predict climate but not weather was intensively studied by Edward Lorenz starting in the 60s. Here is a list of the awards he received for this work:

* 1969 Carl Gustaf Rossby Research Medal, American Meteorological Society.
* 1973 Symons Memorial Gold Medal, Royal Meteorological Society.
* 1975 Fellow, National Academy of Sciences (U.S.A.).
* 1981 Member, Norwegian Academy of Science and Letters.
* 1983 Crafoord Prize, Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences.
* 1984 Honorary Member, Royal Meteorological Society.
* 1989 Elliott Cresson Medal, The Franklin Institute
* 1991 Kyoto Prize for ‘… his boldest scientific achievement in discovering “deterministic chaos” .’.
* 2004 Buys Ballot medal.
* 2004 Lomonosov Gold Medal

I think you need to do more research because your assumptions are remarkably naive and uninformed for somebody claiming to be a physicist who has looked into the issue. Lorenz studied math at Dartmouth and Harvard then received graduate degrees in meteorology from MIT. If you were unable, in your research, to uncover and understand the significance of his work then perhaps your degree is more of the University of Pheonix sort.

The nuke power plant is much more attractive, much cheaper, more reliable and less consumptive of materials. Windmills have two applications: pumping water for the cows on large ranches; and providing occasional electricity in remote locations for deep woods living. Just a dumb idea by dishonest/dumb people.

US oil production peaked in the 70s. There are a few areas of reserves left, such as ANWR and Gulf deep water. The fact that they’re incurring the cost of deep water drilling proves, by the way, that the low hanging fruit is cashed out. Here’s something to think about. If we just have a few reserves left what happens if there is a major world war again? Shouldn’t we keep ANWR available at least for that eventuality, in which case we would need the fuel supply to defend the USA? Again, we peaked in the 70s and we need to keep in mind all the possible contingencies in thinking through whether to lease out the remaining reserves for commercial interests or keep them in reserve for the national interest. Let’s not be short sighted here. Just something to think about.

Oil that we could easily be getting from our own wells if The Child King and his sycophants would stop bowing down to the Eco-Fascist, like the dweeb in this story. Not to mention the fact that the blades are made of aluminum which requires huge amounts of electricity to mfr.

If there are adequate domestic supplies to meet domestic demand then why are we drilling in deep water? Deep water is very risky (spill baby spill) and costly. We wouldn’t be there at all if we hadn’t cashed out all the low hanging fruit. Think it through. Dependence on oil = Dependence on foreign oil. We just don’t have the reserves and if we squeeze out the last drops from the gulf and Alaska we won’t have any at all in case of a national emergency.

Wind has been great for the Iowa economy. We have relatively low unemployment partly because of the manufacturing and maintenance jobs. Jobs baby jobs. A lot of the attack on wind comes from fossil fuel groups trying to protect their corporate welfare and block market competition. Competition is good for consumers and good for jobs, but it is bad for the oligarchs that back the Rep party.

No, turbine blades don’t kill mosquitoes, they kill the bats that EAT the mosquitoes.
There will be more mosquitoes than ever.

Anyone wondering about the “science” used by Global Warming Alarmists might profit from a visit to http://wattsupwiththat.com/
“The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule.” – H.L. Mencken

Talk to Louisiana coast residents, oh yeah can’t see that from Falmouth, so who cares! Perhaps the wrong Turbine was selected for this site. All Wind turbines are not created equal, perhaps Falmouth just didn’t do their home work and selected the wrong turbine to be errected at a site so close to homes! Because there are gas guzzling and polluting cars, then ALL cars must be bad. Wind power was here long before Obama, if you want to Obama bash, please get your facts right, if you care at all and are capable of finding FACTS. Perhaps you would prefer a Millstone instead, there’s no noise! Oh yeah, that’s right, nothing in MY backyard! Be part of the problem or the solution

Don’t be ignorant, oil produce in the USA doesn’t mean that oil will be delivered in the USA. The NYMEX oil price is a benchmark. The oil produced will be delivered by the producer to the highest bidder FOB. When China, Korea or anybody else are the highest bidder, the oil will be delivered there, while refineries in the USA are importing oil from other countries.

Fine, When we drill and refine our own oil, the price and availability will drop and OPEC will no longer have the monopolist stranglehold over the West.

Eye polluting? One more person who can’t figure out they don’t have to stare at the darn things. I’d rather live with eye pollution than pollution that destroys foods sourves and more

Stating the obvious the fact any car wouldn’t fit your needs, doesn’t mean it can’t fit the the majority of the nation. The volt is a plug in hybrid with an estimate range of 375 miles before either charging, filling with fuel, or both. Your comment is off the mark as the comment stating a 200mph figure, and the comment stating a 40 mph top speed.

I once lived in a town where the grain drying blowers could be heard a mile away 24/7. For any of use to use electrical power someone has to live with the pleasantries of producing it. In time my body adjusted to the sound, they people wold would to, but I suspect they are some of those it’s all about me Americans. Americans use of coal has help to destroy a food source of people that live oceans away, and never see the benefits of that coal use. That’s OK because we are as country narcissistic SOB, and #1. Within the US too many are as an individual sometime narcissistic SOB and have no problem sending our crap down stream to others if it makes or saves us a penny. Get off the Obama rants. The infrastructure you are now using, desperately clinging to are are the result of a corporate government collusion that benefited the corporate, and business much more than it did the general population.

what’s a food sourve?

Please lean to open a new tab and doing some research before comment to state facts. The only thong you may have gotten correct is the price.

Wind power blows

Another one who needs to take the time to reserved before stating facts.

Than again we may be lied to as to how inefficient they are.
SHRUG

Thanks for the info. I hadn’t heard about that. I will make it a point to speak to the neighbors to find out how many are having that problem. Do you know where the people live who are having the problem? I’m right next to New Rd. Maybe I should be grateful to the army for pretty much destroying my hearing.

It would be great if the article included an audio to what the turbines actually sound like. Shouldnt be too hard in this day of technology

Wind One is expected to save the town about $375,000 a year in electricity. Heather Harper, Falmouth’s acting town manager, says Falmouth owes about $5 million on the 1.65-megawatt turbine. Odd. Their math doesn’t work. Taking into account the ephemerous nature of wind, that turbine will be hard-pressed to produce 1000 Megawatt-Hours a year. Coal costs are about $3,000 for 1000 Megawatt-Hours. Even at full outrageous super-inflated retail, 20 cents per Kilowatt-hour, that’s only $200,000 per year. Nothing for amortization of the $5 million turbine… Then factor in that the wind only seems to blow when electrical demand is lowest, and you have a boondoggle.

Several problems with your “physics”. First, you have forgotten to include
the effects of any one change on the millions of other things that affect
the atmosphere–like more carbon and heat means more plants which means more
oxygen and less carbon. And you totally ignored another million factors,
like carbon is a greenhouse gas in narrow sheets, but is it a significant
effect when distributed throughout the atmosphere. And there are many ways
to counter global warming if it happens and proves undesirable, and it will
happen someday even if humans disappeared tomorrow. Physics should be left
to physicists because it is very subtle and difficult. And they must be
honest. Climatology is led by incompetents, scientifically and morally.

A few words of advice my friend. Find another cause to hitch your wagon to.
If you had any idea of the equations that truly describe the evolving
atmosphere of the earth, and you understood computer calculations, you would
never seriously suggest what you just said. To gather the initial
conditions alone is beyond our capability, and the continuing external major
variables such as the sun’s output are unknown and unknowable, which ends
the project right there. And hiding behind the false distinction of weather
and climate is tantamount to saying, “I can’t predict the odds of this dice
throw, but I can tell you the average of many throws”, but neither you nor
the jerk Lorenz can do either. Real physicists do physics and occasionally
an award is offered them. They normally turn this down because all it means
is that some committee of obscure physics bureaucrats, and perhaps some
bored foreign royals, want to be kingmakers in their own mind. The awards
below would never be accepted by a practicing physicist because real
physicists are driven people with much better things to do than accept BS
awards. Read Feynman’s reason for dropping out of the National Academy of
Sciences–which does no science and is also populated by scientific
bureaucrats. The Nobel is starting to fall into the category of the crap
listed below, but includes a large sum of money (>megabuck) so is still
acceptable in spite of the week of dreadful ceremonies one must endure.
None of the “awards” below would be accepted by an accomplished physicist.
Deterministic Chaos was laughed away long ago. But the real proof is the
fraud revealed by the emails–and they were the death of AGW theory (climate
change will still happen in fact but we don’ know when) because honest
scientists simply don’t act like those emails revealed, and the tombstone
was the gross failure of the very few predictions they made which can be
verified. Anybody can make long-term predictions because these can not be
verified. I predict that Florida will have a mountain near the everglades
taller than Everest 6,458 years from now–prove me wrong. Harvard graduated
Teddy Kennedy.

ksdoug is a great example of the products of America’s education system. Scientifically ignorant, but a fervent convert to the cult religion of PCism, which includes the scientifically bogus “green” cult. What we call “education’ is now simply Big-Lie indoctrination by the far-left faculties drawn from the drugged-out 60s radicals.

The Net Metering law forces utilities to connect small projects like the Mass Maritime (MMA), Falmouth Waste Water, and others to the grid. This process adds to the operating cost of the utility which is passed on to its other clients.

Net Metering mandates that utilities not only supply supporting power to balance the variability of wind turbines, but must also purchase at list prices any excess energy produced by the turbine. This is the only power utilities buy at list price whether they need it or not.

In effect the law forces utilities to act like storage batteries to service these projects free of charge.

Yes! The owners save money with these project, but the rest us pay for them in our bills, more than likely hidden in the “Generation Charge”.

All the major components of the earth’s atmosphere cause the crust to retrain heat for a while–it can’t be permanent unless stored very efficiently like in petroleum because were that so we would have boiled the oceans long ago.. This heat retention is because of the relationship between the spectral density of radiation being dependent upon the temperature of the emitting body, and the sun is much hotter than the earth. And because the atmospheric molecules have more resonances at lower frequency, where most of the earth radiates, more energy is scattered on the way out that on the way in. But it a multiple scattering and difficult to predict the net effect in a three dimensional collection of scatterers. But the key is that most does return to space over time or the earth would have overheated long ago. But the most important source of heat trapping by far is water vapor. Have you ever noticed that it is much colder in the morning after a clear night than after a cloudy night? I just explained why. The futility in the predictions of the junk science of climatology is that they ignore most of the important variables–like the dominant one of solar intensity. The whole idea of predicting what these hucksters are trying to sell is so absurd I find it difficult to realize that some people actually would believe this crap. I don’t know any physicists who do but there are plenty of people calling themselves “scientists” who have no idea of the reality but are devout believers because it is now a religion to them. Sad what people will do to give their life some meaning. Honest work should do this but they would not have that to fall back upon.

NIMBYism at its worst. Some people are going to be inconvenienced by the essential changes we have to make to combat global climate change.
We have to choose between a few people being inconvenienced vs the catastrophe of runaway climate change. That choice is a no brainer.

What about the concept of environmental justice? Should people who are made ill by chemicals from a fertilizer manufacturer or other industrial process be told they are the inevitable casualties needed to feed, clothe, or otherwise accomodate the rest of us?

Learn to not take everything literally!

The windfarms are due to an investment by Bernie Goldfarb (aka T Boone Pickens) who knows they are economically disatrous but has connections, so the taxpayers will make him even more money.

I can create jobs: dig large holes then fill them up. Raise txes to pay the workers. Shovel ready!

Notice that the religous cult of “green weenies” gets very upset when an oil spill kills a few nasty seagulls. But could care less if one of their religous icons on a windfarm wipes out a few thousand eagles!

And you know this from????

You are simply dumb. Nuclear has been proven for decades and is shovel ready! Except religous dogma from idiots prevents its deployment in this country–but other countries are smarter, which is part of the reason we are headed to the third world.

You do realize that creating boondoggle jobs funded by taxing the productive is couterproductive. Unless a job produces a non-subsidized profit it is an economic burden. You are constantly expressing sophomoric ideas far beyond your intellectual grade.

Worked for a long time and still does–as opposed to wind, tidal, solar and BS

You must be a sociology major!

Learn to communicate without sounding like a professor. The association is not in your interest.

my dear girl: you have been indoctrinated into an evil religion and do not have the scientific background to see what is around you. Go back to teaching!

Why thank you! But no, biology.

Learn more about the power and benefits of wind: http://www.energyinyourlife.com/article.php?t=100000084

Petroleum is nearly fungible which means that it makes no difference where it comes from, just the price is important. (Actually it makes some difference because different crudes offer more or less of the desired refined components than others). The world oil trade is determined, as it should be, by the final price after transportation, taxes, crude quality and other factors are taken into account. This is the beauty of free enterprise–it produces the lowest cost product, that is until the government gets involved after amoral politicians accept campaign donations from unscrupulous oil executives. For example, most Alaskan oil goes to Asia and much of our oil comes from Mexico. This is because the shipping routes offer a net advantage by doing things this way. It is how things should be.

Your point is that nobody really knows the economic merits of windpower. That is why we have free enterprise, which is the most efficient way known to develop limited resources and answer questions about what is the best way to do things. Those who invest in windpower would either make money or lose, depending on the true bottom line. And if they lose, windpower goes back to its historical microfunction of pumping water. But as soon as the industry is subsidized by forcing money from the taxpayer, all the beauty of free enterprise, which has done far more for the world than academic socialists could ever comprehend, fails. It fails because the crap ideas now win out by government force, just like union force results in overpaid workers (and drives the jobs elsewhere). And just as the best source of energy ever, nuclear, has been temporarily forced out of the market by government obstruction paid for by gifts and threats from the enviro hacks.

OK, let me break it down for you. Used as an electric only, this car is basically useless for anyone who doesn’t live in a city. Cities only make up a small fraction of the US. Plus it looks like you did not read the post I was replying to. It cleary stated that the Volt could go 200 mph. I think he meant by the charge not mph, but it looks like sarcasm is totally wasted on you.

I’m not quite sure you’ve been paying attention to the health ramification evident in this series? (Part 1 & 2) The impact seems cancer-like. No one wants to get cancer. In your line of reasoning, that would be just too inconvenient. Cancer happens involuntarily. The inconvenience of this Wind cancer is an injustice. It’s a terrible scar on society. You might argue that a little inhumanity toward your neighbor is necessary if humanity is to stay the catastrophe of runaway climate change. If this is your philosophy, then I say that’s inconvenient.

I didn’t realize that these turbines would be loud enough to cause these things. I liked the interactive link. It helped me understand a little more about what turbines do.

Just another in a long list of examples of the climate fraud be perpetuated by the left. What’s sad is how easy it is to dupe so many people. It’s hard to feel sorry of the dupes that were cheerleading this scam through the planning and instigation process.

I think you are wasting your time asking anarchocapitalist not to be ignorant. You’re argument is right, of course, but that’s not going to matter to him.

Our proven reserves are a tiny fraction of the world’s. We could drill every place we can think of without regard to the environment, hopefully in your front yard, and not make much of a dent in the world price for oil.

And the mechanical maintenance costs – Nobody seems to be factoring that in when advocating for turbines. I think you will find that cost to be way too high v its output and other sources of energy. Wind power isn’t wind power, its mechanically generated power, has moving parts, has moving turbines, blades, all in salty air – A recipe for costly upkeep.

Google this issue and you will see that the maintenance costs simply do not allow for the so called lower cost electricity v other traditional sources..

Neil Licht, Marlborough, Ma

Yeah but then we wouldn’t have a bunch of wind power generation capacity at the end. Free markets work on competition. More competition = more innovation. If you want more of something you subsidize it. The Reps have it exactly backward. They want to subsidize the fossil fuel monopolies and cut investment in competition. At the very least, any rational person can agree with cutting handouts to fossil fuels, even if we disagree about subsidizing competition.

I didn’t say that I oppose nuclear. I think we should have more nuclear and agree that some environmentalists have been shortsighted about nuclear. Keep your cool. Not everyone you talk to fits into your neat little ideological stereotypes.

Your intellectual bluster is funny. Why is it that you feel the need to add all the insults? If your arguments are strong then let them speak for themselves.

Now, to the point. I disagree with your view of subsidies that create jobs. If you were correct, then every job created by a small business that received an SBA loan would be an “economic burden.” That is false. The jobs created by small businesses are jobs that families rely on and that drive our economy. Likewise, the jobs that have been created in Iowa are real jobs that actually ease economic burdens on families.

Here’s where I think your coming from and I think in a sense you’re onto something. In a perfect market (analogy to physics: frictionless plane) allocation of resources would be optimized and interference (subsidy) would be sub-optimal. Here’s where I think you’ve got an intellectual blindspot (ideological). All the arguments you’re making against climate science apply to economics. We don’t have a perfect market. Economic decisions are made by imperfect reasoners with imperfect information acting out of inconstant and inconsistent motives and generating all kinds of uncounted externalities.

At least with the complexity of climate systems we are dealing with more or less deterministic processes rather than the vagueries of human motive and decision. Pollution itself is an example of how we don’t have a perfect market. In a perfect market the cost of pollution would be included in the transaction. But in the real world it is almost always a third party that bears the costs, an externality. Moreover, perfect market theory presupposes competition. Imperfect markets have monopolies and cartels. So, and this pertains exactly to the subsidies creating jobs in Iowa, sometimes to move closer to that perfect market dynamic where competition breads innovation and prosperity, you have to subsidize entry of competition into an imperfect market.

One of my favorite mathematical physicists, who is now working on climate science and renewable energy related issues too, is John Baez. Guys like that, unlike you and me I guess, don’t spend much time shouting at strangers on random message boards (though I’m trying not to shout). My point being, I’m not especially impressed by your efforts at intellectual intimidation.

We had the opportunity to get a governor that was going to buy for 25 cents on the dollar, electricity from Canada. Wasted opportunity but, I think the offer is still available. In addtion that is economical and environmentally friendly.

The less wind power the better, both for the environment and our living
standard. I worked next to Altamont pass in California. The first major
windpower experiment. A total failure and massive loss of money for private
investors and taxpayers. Sane people don’t keep repeating the same
experiment and expect the results to differ (unless it is at the quantum
level).

Entrepreneurs are inherently better allocators of resources than bureaucrats
because it is their own money at risk. Once I am allowed to gamble with the
money of others, I get very prone to taking stupid risk. Pollution is a
subjective concept that has been deified by two groups: half a century ago
the town fathers would point to the smoke from the steel mills in Pittsburg
with pride as a symbol of productivity; enviros see it as the perfect scare
tactic to convince the unsophisticated that the sky is falling . It just
isn’t a serious problem on a world scare. Besides, nature is the biggest
polluter of all in terms of oil spills and sewage–contemplate the excrement
from whales and other marine critters. Extremes, like human pollution
around the Mexican border, and New York City’s dumping of their garbage and
sewage not that far offshore in the ocean should be halted. The rest is
mostly the result of bogus studies or lack of perspective. My intellectual
bluster is because I understand profoundly Physics, mathematics, economics
and history as a result 55 years of serious studying for four hours per day,
plus always working at profit making jobs in R&D, or non-boondoggle defense
programs like the space-based laser. I have earned the right.

Don’t know who Mr. Baez is but anyone who calls themselves a “mathematical
physicist” is living in the past. Real physicists first understand
intuitively what is going on, and then in the few nearly trivial cases which
mathematics can deal with, solve the mathematics. Complex systems can not
be solved by mathematics, except in simplistic principle. Even numerical
solutions with computers are very limited as the projection of hurricanes
paths prove. I know why this is and it will never change. Nature at the
level which determines reality is just too complicated to solve. Flipping a
penny and predicting its outcome is a deterministic act, about a
quintillion, quintillion times easier than solving the earth’s atmoshere,
with the real equations, not to mention the external unknowable driving
forces from the sun and other cosmic radiation which makes the solution
impossible. Tell your hero to solve the penny first. If he can I suggest
he wear a disguise and heads for Vegas.

Those who allow their education to trump the meaning of observed real-life
phenomena around them bother me very much. But I myself did just that until
I was out of academia for a few years. This is how the world was during the
dark ages when the church authorities determined the answer to everything.
If reality contradicted them, then reality (experiment) was wrong. If you
disagreed with the Church–blasphemy! We left that behind a few centuries
back but now it is returning with the new religion of PCism. Very scary
stuff. Nuclear fission was proven decades ago as the most abundant, least
polluting, cheapest form of energy. And nuclear fusion, which powers the
sun, will someday end the energy shortage for everyone forever. But the
green religion has spent vast sums preventing its use in a very unscientific
manner. I was in the heart of some of their efforts when I worked in
research at Livermore National Lab. Their tactics were disgusting.

I know: Until the oil/coal/and gas industries are no longer subsidized, we won’t know the merits of them, either, will we?

Yes, and all that radioactive waste is really attractive, too. Just ask the French, who’ve started t run into an environmental nightmare with their waste: They’ve almost no place left to put it, and the seepage and leakage from the sites they’ve already filled to capacity would give Mr. Anderson and his whiny neighbors a good bit more than their phantom headaches and other psychosomatic maladies.

They may well be subsidized but you probably are wrong on the bottom line
because of the incredible taxes placed upon them, which make any subsidies
pale by comparison. But yes, the government is corrupt and accepts bribes.
The crucial difference is that they were born on their own merits, unlike
wind and solar which have been stillborn even with huge government subsides.
One can never trust government unless the only rewards for being a
politician are love of country, as they originally were. But why someone
who knows windpower, as I do from working next to the first major
installation at Altamonte pass near Livermore ,Ca, and have seen the
pollution, cost and ultimately shutting down of this failure, would support
it is beyond me. It has to be a religious conviction because the economics
and science say NO. But nuclear, free of obstructionists, make wind and
solar a non-solution to a non-problem. We only have an energy problem
because of the whackos in the Sierra Club and similars. The US Navy proved
this decades ago.

The waste problem is a red herring. If we as a nation can’t figure out how
to bury a few trainloads of contaminated material then we should not be
allowed to go outside in the rain. Ever wonder why Hiroshima and Nagasaki
are the world’s most beautiful cities today? Google pictures of them and
you will be amazed. And how did and does our Navy power their large ships
without any problems of this sort? Radioactivity is natural, and deeply
burying it has no doomsday conseques. Sorry, but that is the reality.

The first attempt at windpower was the Altamont Pass fiasco near Livermore, Ca. For some reason, to the best of my knowlege, this has not been analyzed by real engineeers from private industry, and the problems corrected, which would be the logical next step before building another giant wind farm. I knew a lot of the investors at Altamont, and all that kept their investment when the government pulled the plug, lost everything and even more because they were responsible for tearing these monsters down and hauling them to the trash heap. The basic problem besides the visual insult and bird kills, was the massive cost of the electricity produced. This was due in part to the purchase/installation cost, but mainly to the maintenance which was unexpectedly large. I don’t really know why. But what few, if any foresaw, was that the anticipated payment from the Utility Company for supplying power to the grid rarely materialized. This was due to the fact that the power companies will only purchase this windpower when the other, much cheaper, sources of power were running at full capacity. Which almost always happens on very hot days and all the air conditioners are on. Trouble is that, at least in California, the only time it really gets hot is when the wind is not blowing. When the wind is blowing enough to turn the blades it also is bringing fresh, cool Pacific Fog into the population centers so few run their air conditioners. The whole thing suffered from typical bad bureaucratic planning, but this will continue unless the profit motive is restored and the design turned over to private enterprise. There is a reason socialism is such a failure.

Then you should love the towers over oil wells, and the halting of the destruction of our farmland by the total lunacy of subsidizing ethanol. Energy now becomes cheaper and so does food. The known reserves of natural gas and petroleum in the US and Canada are huge. And the projected time until world oil depletion keeps INCREASING because we keep finding more reserves (particularly Russia) faster than our consumption rate. The Sky-is-Falling psychosis has been driving those afflicted into predicting petroleum would dry up for about 90 years now. And if it does, nuclear is of course the ultimate source of energy–far better than any “green” alternative. We just need to clear the obstructionist no-nothings from academia and the Government bureaucracies out of the way, and they can then show us how not to fix real problems like what to do with dangerous obsolete cities, and the invasion of very undesirable illegals. Leave technology to those capable: “Those who can, do. Those who can’t, teach”.

These enviros really are pathetic. Desperately want to be working on something important to prove their value, but either don’t have the know-how or lack the taste for honest work. Sam Walton was an honest contributor to society. Rachael Carlson, Paul Erhlich, Cronkite and similars who founded the silly but dangerous “green” movement amongst our naive children were lying disasters for our future well being, worse than a war.

The real choice is to fire all the paid-off pseudo scientists who have the nerve to think they can predict the net effect of anything on the climate. I am a physicist and would not ever attempt this as it is way beyond the capabilities of science. Statistics don’t help because there is no natural interval over which to average, moreover the small effects are not random. And we have no quality past data for the time required to notice a change, which is hundreds of years for most effects except asteroid impacts or volcanic eruptions. Just way out of the league of climatologists, and even physicists. If you want to worry about something try worrying about asteroid impacts. These can be foreseen and usually diverted. Climate always changes in response to literally thousands of different factors, mainly the solar output which is unknown, and if the change seems to be for the worse then we can probably do something about it. If we can’t, life goes on but we just have to adapt.